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Re: The Myth About Depression

benpaco — Mon, 25 Aug 2014 23:24:06 GMT

Author: benpaco

Posted: 08/26/2014 03:24

I know people whose lives are infinitely better (or even just existent) thanks to conventional drugs. I know others who have become absolute hollow shells of who they used to be.

That said, karbutt, I'm really really glad you're doing better on them.

Re: The Myth About Depression

karbutt — Mon, 25 Aug 2014 23:09:48 GMT

Author: karbutt

Posted: 08/26/2014 03:09

I won't argue that these things (non-medication) don't help, because they clearly do. But I couldn't function normally without my medication. So I couldn't even do those things before.

Re: The Myth About Depression

Anonymous — Sat, 23 Aug 2014 10:25:31 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/23/2014 14:25

Yeah, it seems there's a lot of controversy about the efficacy of medication in treating depression. Most doctors will tell you that even if you're taking meds, you'll be much better off combining it with non-chemical treatments like therapy, exercise, meditation, etc.

I absolutely agree that pills are not a magic cure-all for mood disorders, but there are a wide variety of conditions that are very closely related to depression (bipolar disorder, anxiety disorder, etc.) for which medication can provide definite help. If you're trying to decide whether or not to take medication for any condition, consider your doctor your #1 resource.

Re: The Myth About Depression

Anonymous — Sat, 23 Aug 2014 09:18:06 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/23/2014 13:18

karbutt wrote:

Depression is a disorder. Meditation can help some people but those with chemical imbalances or trauma...

It's important to consider that things we once believed were true, may not actually be so (world is flat etc).

Take a read of this

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/cur...imbalances

I know some people don;t like reading articles so I'll isolate the major points

Quote:

Instead of challenging your beliefs in this chemical imbalance theory of depression, let me stimulate your curiosity. Let me share a yet to be published study by Dr. Brett Deacon and his colleagues. They recruited 91 adults who are clinically depressed or once was. To make this credible, he gave everyone a fake "Rapid Depression Test" that determined whether their serotonin levels were abnormally low compared to other neurotransmitters. To make this test seem legit, they swiped the inside of people's mouths with a cotton swab and the saliva was carefully moved to a sealed container to be taken to the lab for examination. Afterwards, everyone received detailed test results and a random half of participants were told that their serotonin levels were problematic and there is a clear chemical explanation for their depression. The other half were told their serotonin levels were normal and their depression cannot be purely explained by brain chemistry.

The big question: What happens to people when they buy in to a biomedical explanation for their depression?

The answer: Bad things. They become pessimistic that recovery is possible. They become less confident that they can manage and regulate negative moods that arise (and they always do). The notion that depression is their brain's fault does not lessen the stigma or self-blame one bit. And they no longer believe that psychotherapy is a credible or useful strategy for treating their depression and instead, are ready to be dispensed a pill cure. Essentially, they become less flexible in their options for treating depression and less confident that they will escape its clutches.

It is going to be tough to battle the science fiction promoted by pharmaceutical companies. What makes the challenge increasingly difficult is that these companies spent $57.5 billion to promote drugs in 2004, and the numbers are only getting bigger. If we care about reducing human suffering, it's time to bring on the noise and ensure that everyone knows the science. We are fortunate to have scientists that are willing to fight powerful companies and dominant beliefs in search for the truth.

Until they can prove that someone has a chemical imbalance that is causing them to be unhappy and not just making that guess, I personally won;t believe it (and many psychologists believe the same).

The serotonin levels thing is a 50 year old theory that is starting to hold less and less water as we do more research.

Re: The Myth About Depression

karbutt — Fri, 22 Aug 2014 23:44:00 GMT

Author: karbutt

Posted: 08/23/2014 03:44

Depression is a disorder. Meditation can help some people but those with chemical imbalances or trauma...

Re: The Myth About Depression

Anonymous — Sun, 17 Aug 2014 12:33:48 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/17/2014 16:33

Wonderful post Jhereko. Not much I can say that hasn't already been said (other than recounting my own experiences), just wanted to praise the honesty and integrity of this post (which frankly meant far more than the linked article).

Also this

benpaco wrote:

If anyone ever needs to talk, know that I'm here for you, whether we've talked before or not.

And mad respect to everyone sharing their own stories and such. I can relate to so much of what's being said. Again, it means a lot. Thank you all for this.

Re: The Myth About Depression

Norman Bates — Sun, 17 Aug 2014 12:18:48 GMT

Author: Norman Bates

Posted: 08/17/2014 16:18

Jhereko wrote:

Would you tell a child that they're not good enough?

Alas, heard this just a few hours ago. Some of my old friends can be such pricks with their own kids, this is so terribly sad... I was the one who had to reassure the child, I don't even know the kid ffs. 9 y-o. "She won't be no Einstein for sure hahaha". Asshole.

Re: The Myth About Depression

gussteivi — Sun, 17 Aug 2014 02:11:26 GMT

Author: gussteivi

Posted: 08/17/2014 06:11

This thread is why BEA is such a special place.

My thoughts on this are all over the place on this and this post will probably reflect that.
I was depressed when I was 18 for a year and I was emotionally suppressed after that until, well, very very recently (I'm 25).
Because of certain experiences (and lack of them) that would take too long to describe now (I just had an impulse to write "which nobody here is interested in hearing about anyway", which is exactly the kind of thoughts that lead to depression) I could not separate emotions in general from insecurity, in my mind they were the same thing. So what I've been doing in the wake of the depression is shut out my emotions and work on understanding, accepting and embracing my insecurities. It was not a conscious decision, and probably not a wise one either, but in the end things seem to finally have worked out somehow. I've been very lucky to have people around me who are very in touch with their emotions, even if it makes them suffer regularly, who never gave up on me, even when I hurt them in my insecurity and lack of empathy And I owe them eternal gratitude for helpig me finally accept myself as a completely normal human being.
For me insecurity is the most difficult emotion to handle. There is nothing constructive about it, insecurity breeds insecurity and connecting it to other emotions can "ruin" them for me, and allowing my actions to be guided by insecurity is downright paralyzing. It took me a very long time to even understand that it exists as a concept. I remember waking up in the morning before going to school wondering if I was gonna "act weird" today. The next step for me was to understand what those insecuritites where and where they came from. Then I needed to recognize the fact that it is the insecurity itself, and not what I feel insecure about that is the problem. It really is a self-fullfilling prophecy.
Now, I'm not rid of my insecurities, I still have them all the time, but at least I'm able to recognize them as such the very moment they hit me, which makes them infinitely easier to handle.
Based on my experience the key to a healthy emotional life is embracing every single emotion that I have, especially the negative ones ( insecurity, fear, shame, guilt etc.). If I do that they can never do any real harm to me. And crying has a very important role in this too, crying in itself is not pain (and definitely not weakness), crying is just an outlet of emotions in it's purest form (together with laughter, I think one thing that saved me during these years was that I never stopped laughing. BEA gave me it's share of that 😉 ) and I have an obligation towards myself to do it whenever I feel the urge to.
Oh, and of course the most important thing of all is to talk to other people about what I feel. Because sharing with others is the only way to understanding that we are all the same. We are all deep down equally desperate to reach out to, connect and empathize with other people, the only thing keeping us from doing it are our own fears and insecurities. Where I am now in life I really don't think that there are evil people, the word evil is just a very convenient way of explaining a behaviour that you don't understand where it comes from.

"You know that I could be in love with almost everyone,
I think that people are the greatest fun"
It really is like that, bloody hippies they where right all along

Re: The Myth About Depression

pa — Sat, 16 Aug 2014 10:44:13 GMT

Author: pa

Posted: 08/16/2014 14:44

ooops you were talking about Andrew Weiss...
I don't know why but I was thinking about Brian Weiss (author of Many Lives, Many Masters)

sorry 😕

Re: The Myth About Depression

RockyRaccoon — Fri, 15 Aug 2014 14:49:53 GMT

Author: RockyRaccoon

Posted: 08/15/2014 18:49

One thing I heard once that I've always repeated through my life that helps me get through it:

Acceptance of circumstances is not necessarily approval of them.

You can accept what's going on without feeling like you approve of it, you never have to resign yourself to where you are if you don't want to.

Re: The Myth About Depression

Anonymous — Fri, 15 Aug 2014 14:02:29 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/15/2014 18:02

Jhereko wrote:

We have never been told the truth which we all know - WE HAVE ALWAYS BEEN ENOUGH. That simple realisation...is so freeing.

This is my favorite passage from your post. The are no magic bullets for depression, but it helps to remember this: You're the only one that can really decide whether your life is a success. Whether you have a room full of awards and trophies or just a couple friends and family who love you, the ultimate measure of you will always be you.

That's not to say that there's anything wrong with ambition, but make sure your goals are your own and not somebody else's. It made me feel sad reading through some of the BEA confessions, especially those from people who had really negative views of themselves and the forum community. It's impossible to completely isolate yourself from outside influences when it comes to determining your self-worth, but it seemed as if some folks could conceive of little beyond the petty, plastic images painted by the vain. I hope they're the minority.

Anyway, I've done the depression thing, so if anybody feels like they need someone to talk to, I'm always available by PM or on Skype. Much love, BEA.

Re: The Myth About Depression

pa — Fri, 15 Aug 2014 13:27:36 GMT

Author: pa

Posted: 08/15/2014 17:27

I used to meditate every day since 2004, my first meditation was so unstable, full of thoughts…I couldn’t keep quiet for more than 10 minutes.
but with patience ( a lot of patience) I kept on meditating, I knew there was something so full inside of me, a kind of irresistible attraction towards the “unknown”.
One night I woke up, I was between wake and sleep: surrounded, covered, embraced by the peace…an incredible peace and love and I couldn’t stop crying with happiness…
Every day when I woke up I let the peace embracing me and surrounding me, often that peace is following me during the day, sometimes there is absence, sometime there is presence, but the most important thing is that I know that I belong to that peace….in the absence and in the presence.
While travelling in India I’ve met so many interesting people and I used to live in a monastery in the Himalaya mountains, working, walking close to the Ganges and meditating.
The first step towards your “self discovery” is the most important, just having that desire is a incredible thing. The pain is a “call” from your inner reality that says “come back to me”…
I’m loving your words guys, thank u
Ps: Brian Weiss is so nice, have a look on “The New Earth” by Eckhart Tolle, it could help on your path…

Re: The Myth About Depression

meccalecca — Fri, 15 Aug 2014 11:56:27 GMT

Author: meccalecca

Posted: 08/15/2014 15:56

Jhereko wrote:

It affects 100% of people.

I meant to respond to this last night and failed to do so. This is a great post Jhereko.

And I think the above statement sums up an incredibly simple and yet easily forgettable point that we're not alone with our problems. From my own personal experience, along with observations, many of the worst periods of depression stem from that feeling of isolation, and the false belief that no one else out there really can comprehend what you're going through. And this concept leads to a fear in regards to speaking about your problems. But, in reality, there's so many others just like you, attempting to find answers to the same questions.

I've long suffered from chronic depression. The more you learn about the world, life, and everything, the less you know, the less you understand. It's way easier when you're totally ignorant about much of the world. I've lost multiple friends to suicide, murder, freak accidents during high school, and it's something that pretty much stays with me. Haunts me at times. Turn on the news and there's endless war, corruption, poverty, etc. It's not exactly uplifting. And it's easy to let all of that eat away at any shred of optimism you have in your soul. And once you lose religion, you have even less to look forward to. Life can feel pointless a lot of the time.

But there are moments that remind you that it's still worth living, even if they're subtle. Whether it be the magnetic nature of love, the overpowering joy of helping someone, sharing a drink and a laugh with an old friend, there are magical moments that occasionally clear the skies of the looming dark masses that usually follow you.

My personal obsession with music very much center around depression and the way a song can comfort me in indescribable ways. Elliott Smith, Mark Kozelek, and many others made music I could relate to to such an extent that it could pull me out of the deepest pits of despair. Following the loss of a friend in high school, I remember putting Minor Threat's "Out of Step" on repeat, staring into space, and then having i ultimately bring me back into feeling like I could indeed still find my place in the world.

Re: The Myth About Depression

Anonymous — Fri, 15 Aug 2014 03:52:56 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/15/2014 07:52

Thanks RepoMan

Very good point about persisting though it may be difficult at first. I think I've talked on here before about how my brain would go a gazillion miles and hour and think about 50 different things at once. But I now have unbelievable focus and peace of mind.

So yeah it is something to start with steps and progress every day. Even if you just do it for 5-10 minutes a day.

And Medication would be a whole different conversation lol.

Re: The Myth About Depression

benpaco — Fri, 15 Aug 2014 01:53:42 GMT

Author: benpaco

Posted: 08/15/2014 05:53

RepoMan wrote:

This experience is also quite common for many of my patients starting meditation. Again, paradoxically, with time meditation can become your best ally for dealing with these feelings and dealing with the scariness of finding it difficult to breath. It's a crazy sensation that I know myself all to well. Meditation has become my biggest ally with dealing with my own severe medical conditions (which I am not going to get into here).

I'm simply encouraging you not to give up on it since I've seen all the wonders it can do as Jhereko mentioned. It can really be an amazing ally and make you more comfortable and at peace with both yourself and your medical condition.

Here are two awesome books on it that I Highly Recommend to everyone...

Thumbnail. Click to enlarge.

http://www.amazon.com/Beginning-Mindfulness-Learning-Way-Awareness/dp/1577314417

Thumbnail. Click to enlarge.

http://www.amazon.com/Buddha-Walks-into...amp;sr=1-1

If I may add, for those of us who can't focus not due to energy but due to fears/nerves I recommend Jamail Yogis' books. Bit autobiographical at times but I've enjoyed them. Can't say I can meditate except for around the ocean, actually. For less meditation tips but more on why the ocean can help as much, see Bluemind by Wallace J Nichols - flipping fantastic book.

Re: The Myth About Depression

Anonymous — Fri, 15 Aug 2014 01:08:08 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/15/2014 05:08

AlexZangari wrote:

I wrote up a whole reply thinking you said "try medication." I'm glad I reread your post before I sent it and embarrassed myself. 🤡

While I have tried (and enjoyed) meditating, I eventually came to realise it probably wasn't best for me. Clearing my mind is exceptionally difficult. I have ADD and my thoughts go at about a million miles per hour. I've tried focusing on breathing but that only ends up making me uncomfortable and paranoid (I have weak lungs from medical conditions/surgeries). I've also tried repeating a phrase but that doesn't hypnotize me all too easily. I do recommend meditation to friends who are lost in their own troubles though.

I just want to encourage you to not give up on meditation even though you've obviously already given it what would seem to be a fair trial. Meditation is extremely difficult for everyone. Although it varies from person to person, it is not uncommon for it to take even years to develop a good practice. Paradoxically, it's precisely because your "thoughts go at about a million miles per hour" that meditation would be incredibly helpful to you. I cannot think of anything else besides exercise that would be helpful for that situation and considering your weak lungs I don't know how vigorous your exercise can be ( although I still strongly encourage daily exercise in even my most debilitated patients (I'm a neurologist who specializes in neurorehabilitation).)

AlexZangari wrote:

I've tried focusing on breathing but that only ends up making me uncomfortable and paranoid (I have weak lungs from medical conditions/surgeries).

Thumbnail. Click to enlarge.

http://www.amazon.com/Beginning-Mindfulness-Learning-Way-Awareness/dp/1577314417

Thumbnail. Click to enlarge.

http://www.amazon.com/Buddha-Walks-into...amp;sr=1-1

Re: The Myth About Depression

AlexZangari — Thu, 14 Aug 2014 23:59:19 GMT

Author: AlexZangari

Posted: 08/15/2014 03:59

I wrote up a whole reply thinking you said "try medication." I'm glad I reread your post before I sent it and embarrassed myself. 🤡

While I have tried (and enjoyed) meditating, I eventually came to realise it probably wasn't best for me. Clearing my mind is exceptionally difficult. I have ADD and my thoughts go at about a million miles per hour. I've tried focusing on breathing but that only ends up making me uncomfortable and paranoid (I have weak lungs from medical conditions/surgeries). I've also tried repeating a phrase but that doesn't hypnotize me all too easily. I do recommend meditation to friends who are lost in their own troubles though.

Re: The Myth About Depression

Anonymous — Thu, 14 Aug 2014 22:15:54 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/15/2014 02:15

AlexZangari wrote:

(I've always felt like I've sat outside the "in" club on BEA

I think most if not all people here consider you and your penis part of the inner circle.

Quote:

It's not just the suicidal ones that need help.

This is a really good point. Living with depression to a natural grave is perhaps a worse fate than killing yourself. And I'd encourage you (and absolutely everyone actually) to at least try meditation because it's the single biggest factor in what got me to the place I am now (from telling myself I was a useless piece of sh!t on a daily basis to loving every part of myself).

Re: The Myth About Depression

Anonymous — Thu, 14 Aug 2014 22:01:41 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/15/2014 02:01

Kiki wrote:

I don't like what you have wrote for so many reasons Jhereko but if that is how you feel then you say that. I'd rather not get into an argument still... I vehemently disagree with a few things up there.

Yes, I'd love to hear you elaborate on this. Particularly because of the many times on here you've stated you've been scared to reveal certain things about yourself etc.

Re: The Myth About Depression

AlexZangari — Thu, 14 Aug 2014 21:26:59 GMT

Author: AlexZangari

Posted: 08/15/2014 01:26

Yeah I'm curious about what outlaw's talking about too. I don't think anyone's here to pick a fight if you want to start a two-sided discussion.