Best Ever Albums

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

Anonymous — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 16:47:59 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 04/06/2014 20:47

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semantic_change

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

mickilennial — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 15:11:27 GMT

Author: mickilennial

Posted: 04/06/2014 19:11

*shrug* I liked the Ramones and Bad Religion before I came around to Green Day.

Quote:

mainly because the masses consumed it under that label.

The masses perception and ignorance bothers me too much to "accept" such "mislabeling", it's not a case of purism in my mind but of accurate knowledge and perception. But this is obvious from my emo rant a month back and so forth.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

Anonymous — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 14:44:15 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 04/06/2014 18:44

Gowienczyk wrote:

I think it varies from person to person; personally I don't find genres "all important" but I do find myself fascinated to the point I defend their utility and history.

I absolutely agree. Though genres may not be terribly important for the listening experience, I think they can be tremendously useful in understanding music history, a topic that obviously interests me.

But yeah, virtually anything that crosses over to mainstream radio play will have to make "adjustments" that will upset genre purists. I would be less hesitant to label Green Day as "punk" or "pop punk" than some, mainly because the masses consumed it under that label. Or, to quote mecca,

Quote:

I can accept Green Day being classified as punk since it's their being branded as punk that led me to what we'd both be more readily willing to accept as actual punk rock.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

benpaco — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 14:38:34 GMT

Author: benpaco

Posted: 04/06/2014 18:38

meccalecca wrote:

I definitely know all about this stuff. It was a huge part of my life. There's definitely a distinction between what was coming out of the west coast vs east coast or Europe when it comes to punk, although the influences circulated.

Punk has always been an ill-defined term that was thrown at bands that never asked for it. As much as early Green Day may have been influenced by bands such as Bad Religion and Wire, they were always heavily influenced by The Kinks and the Who, which are not considered punk. Green Day is really just a pop rock band influenced by punk and british invasion rock.

But this all goes to show how genre labels are not all that important and only tell a small portion of a story

Agreed, and I didn't mean that as an attack on you or anything if it came across like that. It's hard to label genres, in this case it's almost better to just go by record label, I'd say calling Green Day a Lookout! Record band sums them up better than most genres would.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

mickilennial — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 14:29:44 GMT

Author: mickilennial

Posted: 04/06/2014 18:29

Quote:

Green Day is really just a pop rock band influenced by punk and british invasion rock.

This. Same goes for Blink-182, Sum41, etc. Pop-punk at least as a genre indicator had always meant to describe punk bands who employed pop hooks and melodies which happened to be heavy into what the Ramones sounded like. This definition never died, teenage journalism just ruined it, and bands like Teenage Bottlerocket or The Lillingtons get swept under due to bands like Taking Back Sunday or All Time Low getting thought of a genre they did not play. Pop-rock and power pop are not bad labels, people need to remember that.

Quote:

But this all goes to show how genre labels are not all that important

I think it varies from person to person; personally I don't find genres "all important" but I do find myself fascinated to the point I defend their utility and history.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

meccalecca — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 14:25:33 GMT

Author: meccalecca

Posted: 04/06/2014 18:25

benpaco wrote:

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

meruizh — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 14:25:06 GMT

Author: meruizh

Posted: 04/06/2014 18:25

Answering the thread topic..... NONE

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

benpaco — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 14:15:35 GMT

Author: benpaco

Posted: 04/06/2014 18:15

meccalecca wrote:

american west coast pop punk branded and sold to my generation as punk rock. I can accept Green Day being classified as punk since it's their being branded as punk that led me to what we'd both be more readily willing to accept as actual punk rock.

You know, if you listen to where all of that music was rooted, most of those bands started as really just punk, some even pretty hardcore. It's strange to me how the bands changed to gain fame, as they had already been catching traction, at least locally. Ya know, to say that it was "West Coast Pop Punk" isn't neccessarily fair, as a lot of the bands really did start to get fame via punk, and a lot of bands stayed punk. You can hear where the pop-punk starts to come in with such still classic punk bands as the following:

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Then you can see the real pop-punk fully being displayed in other influential west coasters such as:

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Early Green Day truly was less pop-punk than some of the other things out there, though still had pop-punk in them from the start:

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But at the same time as all of this, there's other things going on that are PUNK that really, really helped form this.

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Even bands that went on to be pop-punk and it's derivatives didn't start that way, often:

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So to call it simply that the west coast was in pop-punk, I don't think that's fair. I think a lot of them became pop-punk, maybe, but I'd say overall it was a punk movement.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

ProfessorSquid — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 14:15:13 GMT

Author: ProfessorSquid

Posted: 04/06/2014 18:15

thirdpeng wrote:

do you remember jman's chart when he first came here and the music he talked about, that is the extent of what most men over the age of 30 here understand about music

Do you really believe that about most men on here? Or are you just talking about the general population?

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

benpaco — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 13:36:58 GMT

Author: benpaco

Posted: 04/06/2014 17:36

Jackwc wrote:

Nirvana is completely dadrock now - call it an innevitable symptom of their overwhelming mainstream popularity. The "under-appreciated" bands like the Pixies (under-appreciated by who, exactly? Have you read a single music blog or zine in the last 20+ years?) were spared this fate because they never really got mainstream radio play, and for this we should be glad.

Ya know, it's weird, out where I am I'd say Pixies get as much play as Nirvana if not more on both the indie channels and the just general rock channels. I've even heard both on what is essentially the dadrock station (I've only ever heard it when getting a ride from anyone else's dad, frankly. It's all just Floyd, AC/DC, Zepplin, Sabbath, and they're starting to throw in Nirvana and Pixies).

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

meccalecca — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 13:23:49 GMT

Author: meccalecca

Posted: 04/06/2014 17:23

sp4cetiger wrote:

I never really saw the punk revival as competing with grunge or alternative. A lot of the kids I hung out with were listening to both in the mid-90s.

Agreed.

but Nü Metal came and ruined everything

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

Anonymous — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 13:21:43 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 04/06/2014 17:21

newbands1 wrote:

After grunge killed hair metal there seemed to be nothing be grunge bands then Dookie came out and killed that too and made a whole bunch of people who would never listen to punk rock listen to that genre.I guess Nirvana were just lucky, if they broke up after bleach another band would have taken their place.

I never really saw the punk revival as competing with grunge or alternative. A lot of the kids I hung out with were listening to both in the mid-90s.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

meccalecca — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 13:17:05 GMT

Author: meccalecca

Posted: 04/06/2014 17:17

Norman Bates wrote:

Green Day is NOT punk rock.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

Norman Bates — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 13:13:21 GMT

Author: Norman Bates

Posted: 04/06/2014 17:13

Green Day is NOT punk rock.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

newbands1 — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 13:08:36 GMT

Author: newbands1

Posted: 04/06/2014 17:08

After grunge killed hair metal there seemed to be nothing be grunge bands then Dookie came out and killed that too and made a whole bunch of people who would never listen to punk rock listen to that genre.I guess Nirvana were just lucky, if they broke up after bleach another band would have taken their place.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

meccalecca — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 12:08:09 GMT

Author: meccalecca

Posted: 04/06/2014 16:08

newbands1 wrote:

[Was originally going to add more albums but decided to stick to genres closest to Nevermind]

I love essentially every album you mentioned. Drive Like Jehu's self-titled is particularly underrated. It's crazy that it only ranks 121st on BEA in 1991.

That said. Nevermind is a treasure as well. Maybe Nirvana wasn't the "best" band of the 90s, but they're the rock band that made the biggest impression on the American rock landscape in the 1990s. For better or worse, because of their wild success, major labels sought out bands like Afghan Whigs and Modest Mouse, and refocused attention away from hair metal.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

Jackwc — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 12:05:24 GMT

Author: Jackwc

Posted: 04/06/2014 16:05

Mies wrote:

My dad dislikes everything that was released after The Wall. So he dislikes Nirvana, too.

Aniway, maybe I just live in a shitty place (that's possible), but Nirvana have never been on the radio so much.

Also, I don't like too much Nevermind (I think In Utero is much better), but anyway Nevermind was truly important for popular music at the time, many guys who lived that moment still remember that.

Yes.

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

Anonymous — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 11:51:22 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 04/06/2014 15:51

Norman Bates wrote:

But don't you think Nirvana is today's dadrock?

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

Jackwc — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 11:04:29 GMT

Author: Jackwc

Posted: 04/06/2014 15:04

Norman Bates wrote:

But don't you think Nirvana is today's dadrock?

Re: 20 Albums from 1990/91 That are better than Nevermind

Anonymous — Sun, 6 Apr 2014 08:21:17 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 04/06/2014 12:21

I think this is an excellent thread...

... for KidA to post in!