Best Ever Albums

Re: Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

PurpleHazel — Mon, 21 Jan 2019 18:03:49 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 01/21/2019 23:03

StreetSpirit wrote:

But KC Confidential and Where the Sidewalk Ends are both excellent and about as noir as it gets. So I still feel #50 and #55 seem a bit low.

Both very good films, but there are ~50 other noir movies I like as much (not necessarily all the ones that were ahead of the two you're highlighting on the list), a handful of which didn't even make the cut.

StreetSpirit wrote:

By the way, I didn't notice there was a reply on this thread until now due to the non-stop posting on the 'You must listen to the album below you' games (which I'm admittedly guilty of). It's too easy for these movie poll threads to get buried and go unnoticed, especially when there are album tournaments going on. Therefore I highly suggest future movie polls be posted in the Movies & TV Section where they belong. They may be more visible there, leading to higher participation. I'm not an admin, but if I was, I'd move all the past movie polls there as well.

I 100% agree with all of this -- including the past polls part! If the BETH tournament catches fire -- and when the 2018 BEAMA tournament starts up in June -- it'll be worse.

Re: Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

CA Dreamin — Mon, 21 Jan 2019 13:29:43 GMT

Author: CA Dreamin

Posted: 01/21/2019 18:29

PurpleHazel wrote:

Quote:

- I would've liked higher placements for KC Confidential, Caged, and Where the Sidewalk Ends, but at least they're represented.

Caged isn't always framed as noir, so I'm glad it made the cut at all (well, our inclusions cinched that). Excellent movie!

True, and that maybe why Caged landed at #74. But KC Confidential and Where the Sidewalk Ends are both excellent and about as noir as it gets. So I still feel #50 and #55 seem a bit low.

Nevertheless, I gotta say this list turned out great overall.

By the way, I didn't notice there was a reply on this thread until now due to the non-stop posting on the 'You must listen to the album below you' games (which I'm admittedly guilty of). It's too easy for these movie poll threads to get buried and go unnoticed, especially when there are album tournaments going on. Therefore I highly suggest future movie polls be posted in the Movies & TV Section where they belong. They may be more visible there, leading to higher participation. I'm not an admin, but if I was, I'd move all the past movie polls there as well.

Re: Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

PurpleHazel — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 01:51:54 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 01/20/2019 06:51

StreetSpirit wrote:

Some notes/observations:

- Billy Wilder takes the top 2 spots. I guess he's king of both classic rom-com and classic noir. But I question Sunset Blvd at #2. Fantastic film indeed, arguably better than Double Indemnity. But I'm not sure it's "noir enough" if that makes sense.

It does! It's near the edge of noir, but at the same time, elevates the genre/cycle. While Double Indemnity is arguably the prototype.

Quote:

- I thought M wasn't eligible.

It wasn't outright ineligible. As you suggested previously there's a continuum of proto-noir. On the American side there's You Only Live Once, Fury, I was a Fugitive from a Chain Gang, Underworld, Docks of New York etc. On the European side, there's poetic realist films like Le jour se leve (super-noirish, which is why I included it in my list), Port of Shadows, Le Bête Humaine, Pepe le Moko... and then M. The 30s (and 20s) films are a gray area, so I neither endorsed them or outright disqualified them. I would've been bummed if M ended up in the top 5. It would've been a little like what you said about Sunset Boulevard X3. Someone else put the 1951 American remake on their list.

Quote:

- I would've liked higher placements for KC Confidential, Caged, and Where the Sidewalk Ends, but at least they're represented.

Caged isn't always framed as noir, so I'm glad it made the cut at all (well, our inclusions cinched that). Excellent movie!

Re: Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

PurpleHazel — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 01:20:28 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 01/20/2019 06:20

badseed wrote:

it does seem a bit random with some placements.

Yeah, placements, inclusions, exclusions. Then again, it also includes quite a few deserving lesser-known films like Act of Violence, Ride the Pink Horse, Crime Wave and 99 River Street, so there's a lot good to say too. Wish The Line-Up had made it.

Quote:

Happy to see Gun Crazy did so well. That one is definitely a personal favorite of mine that I've loved for half my life. Didn't realize it was that popular.

It's become known as one of the best B-noirs. Key young lovers on the run movie with the couple loving guns as much as (more than?) each other!

HokeMoseley wrote:

- I love The Killing, but top 3 is definitely a bit high.

Even though I put it at #4, I agree! It's one of the noirs that people who don't haven't seen much noir have seen.

Quote:

- Out of the Past to me is the quintessential noir. Should be top 5.

It IS the quintessential noir, touches every one of the bases.

Quote:

- Killer's Kiss making the list. 🤔 🤔 :-k

Agree again. Has a film ever been so technically advanced and yet so completely incompetent in dialogue, characterization and storytelling? Shows that Jim Thompson brought a lot to the table with The Killing (not that he's the only reason The Killing's a much better film).

Nightmare Alley (46) and Somewhere in the Night (75) are major noirs, and to my mind, Thieves' Highway (48] and The Strange Love of Martha Ivers (39) are too. Don't remember Pickup on South Street well -- can't rewatch it till Criterion finally gets around to upgrading their old DVD to Blu-ray!

Sorry, Wrong Number's a play adaptation and stagy -- Just okay, but well-known because of Stanwyck and Lancaster. Call Northside 777 is a pretty good wrongly accused drama, but not much noir flavor -- based on a real story of a reporter taking up the cause of a convicted murderer.

I don't remember Clash by Night having much of a crime element, though because it's Fritz Lang, Stanwyck and Robert Ryan it always gets classified as noir -- more a dark drama. Niagara doesn't have that good a rep (don't remember it well), but since it's a Marilyn Monroe vehicle, it's another noir general audiences have seen. Authentic color noir, though!

Never saw or really heard of the British Tiger Bay. A Bobbyb5 left-field choice.

Re: Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

Hayden — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 12:42:12 GMT

Author: Hayden

Posted: 01/19/2019 17:42

badseed wrote:

even if it does seem a bit random with some placements.

Like what? I actually think the rankings are quite fair. My only disappointment is Elevator to the Gallows landing criminally low.

EDIT: I DIDN'T EVEN PUT IT ON MY LIST 🧱 🧱 🧱 🧱 AAAARRGGGHH

Re: Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

CA Dreamin — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 12:32:28 GMT

Author: CA Dreamin

Posted: 01/19/2019 17:32

Very cool list!

Some notes/observations:

- Billy Wilder takes the top 2 spots. I guess he's king of both classic rom-com and classic noir. I totally agree with Double Indemnity at #1 (and given it's 86 points ahead of #2, I assume many agree). But I question Sunset Blvd at #2. Fantastic film indeed, arguably better than Double Indemnity. But I'm not sure it's "noir enough" if that makes sense.
- Love the high placements of Gun Crazy and Detour. badseed, your fondness for the former is not alone.
- I thought M wasn't eligible.
- I would've liked higher placements for KC Confidential, Caged, and Where the Sidewalk Ends, but at least they're represented.
- I need to see Out of the Past. Two of you are pissed it isn't higher and it's all my fault :lol:. Fwiw, that's by far the highest film on this list I haven't seen.
- Maltese Falcon not in the Top 10 feels a little weird
- Laura and The Big Sleep should be higher.
- Night and the City should be lower.

Re: Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

HokeMoseley — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 11:39:38 GMT

Author: HokeMoseley

Posted: 01/19/2019 16:39

Great results and excellent work, buddy!

Some observations...

- I love The Killing, but top 3 is definitely a bit high. The Kubrick worship needs to chill a little.
- Out of the Past to me is the quintessential noir. Should be top 5.
- Killer's Kiss making the list. 🤔 🤔 🤔
- Pitfall and Elevator to the Gallows deserved much better.
- I never thought of A Place in the Sun as a noir. I guess I should have voted for it.
- Very glad Moonrise got some support outside of my list.
- The Set-Up not in the top 50? Absolutely criminal.
- I'm not the biggest Big Sleep fan on the planet, but I'm kind of stunned it isn't higher.
- Glad I pushed Violent Saturday onto the list. A bizarre technicolor noir/melodrama/heist film that works way better than it should.

Definitely a great list overall.

What I haven't seen, for my own reference: Pickup on South Street (33), The Strange Love of Martha Ivers (39), Nightmare Alley (46), Thieves' Highway [48], Ossessione (53), Niagara (61), Le jour se lève (64), Quai des Orfévres (73), Caged (74), Somewhere in the Night (75), Sorry, Wrong Number (76), Fury (83), Clash by Night (85), You Only Live Once (86), Stray Dog (89), Call Northside 777 (91), Tiger Bay (94), Detective Story (96).

Re: Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

badseed — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 06:30:42 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 01/19/2019 11:30

Well that's pretty cool. One of our nicer lists, even if it does seem a bit random with some placements. I can't complain though. Happy to see Gun Crazy did so well. That one is definitely a personal favorite of mine that I've loved for half my life. Didn't realize it was that popular.

Best Ever (Classic) Film Noir [LIST]

PurpleHazel — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 21:45:11 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 01/19/2019 02:45

1. Double Indemnity (Billy Wilder, 1944) 621 pts.
2. Sunset Boulevard (Billy Wilder, 1950) 535
3. The Killing (Stanley Kubrick, 1956) 517
4. The Asphalt Jungle (John Huston, 1950) 507
5. Strangers on a Train (Alfred Hitchcock, 1951) 500
6. Touch of Evil (Orson Welles, 1958) 478
7. Night and the City (Jules Dassin, 1950) 472
8. Out of the Past (Jacques Tourneur, 1947) 468
9. The Third Man (Carol Reed, 1949) 467
10. The Big Heat (Fritz Lang, 1953) 457
11. Gun Crazy (Joseph H. Lewis, 1949) 440
12. In a Lonely Place (Nicholas Ray, 1950) 430
13. The Night of the Hunter (Charles Laughton, 1955) 421
14. Detour (Edgar G. Ulmer, 1945) 414
15. Sweet Smell of Success (Alexander Mackendrick, 1957) 395
16. The Killers (Robert Siodmak, 1946) 390
17. The Maltese Falcon (John Huston, 1941) 389 #96
18. Ace in the Hole (Billy Wilder, 1951) 389 #93
19. Scarlet Street (Fritz Lang, 1945) 389 #92
20. They Live by Night (Nicholas Ray, 1949) 385
21. White Heat (Raoul Walsh, 1949) 379
22. The Big Sleep (Howard Hawks, 1946) 377
23. Rififi (Jules Dassin, 1955) 359
24. Kiss Me Deadly (Robert Aldrich, 1955) 337
25. Laura (Otto Preminger, 1944) 332
26. Vertigo (Alfred Hitchcock, 1958) 305
27. Key Largo (John Huston, 1948) 294
28. Mildred Pierce (Michael Curtiz, 1945) 292
29. The Narrow Margin (Richard Fleischer, 1952) 291
30. Act of Violence (Fred Zinnemann, 1948) 290
31. Gilda (Charles Vidor, 1946) 286
32. The Postman Always Rings Twice (Tay Garnett, 1946) 277
33. Pickup on South Street (Samuel Fuller, 1953) 267
34. The Lady From Shanghai (Orson Welles, 1947) 263
35. Shadow of a Doubt (Alfred Hitchcock, 1943) 247
36. Criss Cross (Robert Siodmak, 1949) 240
37. Rebecca (Alfred Hitchcock, 1940) 238
38. The Stranger (Orson Welles, 1946) 235
39. The Strange Love of Martha Ivers (Lewis Milestone, 1946) 225
40. Force of Evil (Abraham Polonsky, 1948) 222
41. High Sierra (Raoul Walsh, 1941) 219
42. The Woman in the Window (Fritz Lang, 1944) 217
43. Ride the Pink Horse (Robert Montgomery, 1947) 213
44. Sudden Fear (David Miller, 1952) 210 #98
45. Brute Force (Jules Dassin, 1947) 210 #73
46. Nightmare Alley (Edmund Golding, 1947) 208
47. The Prowler (Joseph Losey, 1951) 204
48. Thieves' Highway (Jules Dassin, 1949) 203
49. Raw Deal (Anthony Mann, 1948) 197
50. Kansas City Confidential (Phil Karlson, 1952) 195
51. Notorious (Alfred Hitchcock, 1946) 192
52. The Set-Up (Robert Wise, 1949) 185
53. Ossessione (Luchino Visconti, 1943) 174
54. The Breaking Point (Michael Curtiz, 1950) 168
55. Where the Sidewalk Ends (Otto Preminger, 1950) 167
56. Moonrise (Frank Borzage, 1948) 166
57. Murder, My Sweet (Edward Dmytryk, 1944) 166
58. The Hitch-Hiker (Ida Lupino, 1953) 160
59. Kiss of Death (Henry Hathaway, 1947) 158
60. On Dangerous Ground (Nicholas Ray, 1951) 158
61. Niagara (Henry Hathaway, 1953) 154
62. Odds Against Tomorrow (Robert Wise, 1959) 148
63. Gaslight (George Cukor, 1944) 147
64. Le jour se lève (Marcel Carné, 1939) 145
65. Dark Passage (Delmer Daves, 1947) 145
66. A Place in the Sun (George Stevens, 1951) 143
67. Road House (Jean Negulesco, 1948) 141
68. Body and Soul (Robert Rossen, 1947) 139
69. Cape Fear (J. Lee Thompson, 1962) 138
70. Pitfall (Andre de Toth, 1948) 135
71. The Naked City (Jules Dassin, 1948) 134
72. Angel Face (Otto Preminger, 1952) 130
73. Quai des Orfévres (Henri-Georges Clouzot, 1949) 129
74. Caged (John Cromwell, 1950) 126
75. Somewhere in the Night (Joseph L. Mankiewicz, 1946) 125
76. Sorry, Wrong Number (Anatole Litvak, 1948) 124 (3 lists)
77. 99 River Street (Phil Karlson, 1953) 124
78. Elevator to the Gallows (1958, Louis Malle) 122 #87
79. DOA (Rudolph Mate, 1950) 122 #80
80. Crossfire (Edward Dmytryk, 1947) 122 #74
81. Where Danger Lives (John Farrow 1950) 119
82. Crime Wave (André De Toth 1954) 116
83. Fury (Fritz Lang, 1936) 115
84. Champion (Mark Robson, 1949) 114 #67
85. Clash by Night (Fritz Lang, 1952) 114 #55
84. You Only Live Once (Fritz Lang, 1937)114 #50
88. Killer's Kiss (Stanley Kubrick, 1955) 113
87. Leave Her to Heaven (John M. Stahl, 1945) 113
89. Stray Dog (Akira Kurosawa, 1949) 109
90. The Wrong Man (Alfred Hitchcock, 1956) 104
91. Call Northside 777 (Henry Hathway, 1948) 102
92. The Blue Dahlia (George Marshall, 1946) 97
93. M (Fritz Lang, 1931) 94 (1 list)
94. Tiger Bay (J. Lee Thompson, 1959) 93 (1 list)
95. Suspicion (Alfred Hitchcock, 1941) 92
96. Detective Story (William Wyler, 1951) 92
97. The Fallen Idol (Carol Reed, 1948) 91 (1 list)
98. Panic in the Streets (Elia Kazan, 1950) 90
99. Violent Saturday (Richard Fleischer, 1955) 90 (1 list)
100. The Letter (William Wyler, 1940) 89 (1 list)

226 films were submitted in 9 lists. Two films, Sunset Boulevard and Strangers on a Train, appeared on every list. Four films appeared on 8 lists: Double Indemnity, The Killing, The Asphalt Jungle and Night and the City. Conversely, four films appeared on only one list, but had high enough scores to make the final list and they are marked.

Will add a list of films appearing on at least two charts in the next few days.

Thanks to everyone who submitted a list, whether long and short. I appreciate every one.

Personal note: Pretty surprised Out of the Past didn't make the top 5 and The Maltese Falcon didn't make the top 10.