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Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

babyBlueSedan — Tue, 28 Jul 2020 14:30:44 GMT

Author: babyBlueSedan

Posted: 07/28/2020 18:30

Spyglass wrote:

Horror's been at its best this last decade. It and The Lighthouse are currently my two favorite horror movies. Jacob's Ladder (not the remake) comed in third. I honestly loved The Lighthouse so much that I bothered to watch Twilight for Robert Pattinson. There are still some modern horror movies I need to watch, but come fucking on these top two were brilliant.

If you want more Robert Pattison you can do better than Twilight 🤣 . I thought he was great in both High Life and Good Time.

Also, agreed about horror being great last decade, The Lighthouse is probably my favorite film I've seen. I think directors have been great at coming up with exciting settings for films (both of Robert Eggers's last two fit this well).

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

Spyglass — Tue, 28 Jul 2020 11:54:26 GMT

Author: Spyglass

Posted: 07/28/2020 15:54

Horror's been at its best this last decade. It and The Lighthouse are currently my two favorite horror movies. Jacob's Ladder (not the remake) comed in third. I honestly loved The Lighthouse so much that I bothered to watch Twilight for Robert Pattinson. There are still some modern horror movies I need to watch, but come fucking on these top two were brilliant.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

PurpleHazel — Sat, 20 Jul 2019 15:55:15 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 07/20/2019 19:55

badseed wrote:

Well no, I wasn't planning to hold the horror one off. I don't know where or how it came across that I might do that.

Because you seemed to want me to do the poll, and I didn't think you'd want them to run 100% concurrently:

badseed wrote:

PurpleHazel wrote:

Sounds like you're into me doing one of the polls. Which one do you prefer?

I feel like they're both relatively equal in my eyes when it comes to how bad I'd like to do them.

I wasn't actually completely assuming you'd delay the poll, but thought it likely that if I did a poll you'd want to delay at least a few weeks. But no worries.

Quote:

I was hoping someone would start one two months ago.

I was planning to do the gangster one, but when the time came, I talked myself out of it because I was concerned it would be too narrow a category to get enough lists.

Late July's not the greatest time to start a (month or 2-month) poll anyway.

Quote:

I watched Goodfellas the other day and it really just doesnt hold up that well for me. I don't get the hype.

Goodfellas is probably my favorite gangster movie. A textbook on how to adapt a true story. I've never gotten the hype for Miller's Crossing -- but I've only seen it once, so maybe it's not fair for me to judge it.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

badseed — Sat, 20 Jul 2019 05:58:15 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 07/20/2019 09:58

PurpleHazel wrote:

Fooling around with making lists, I found that 50 worked better with both genres. But I wouldn't discourage more. All right, if you're down with holding off on the horror poll, I guess I'll post a gangster movie poll early next week, unless someone voices a strong preference for war.

Yeah, a Coppola film is pretty much a lock for the #1 spot of either poll, with Goodfellas perhaps being the dark horse.

Well no, I wasn't planning to hold the horror one off. I don't know where or how it came across that I might do that. I was hoping someone would start one two months ago. We've reached the point where if I wait until yours is done there won't be much time if I want to post it on Halloween. I'm not opposed to running them simultaneously but that would interfere with those who like to watch a lot of stuff for their lists. That is if people like that are still around.

I watched Goodfellas the other day and it really just doesnt hold up that well for me. I don't get the hype. If a 90s movie is gonna spoil let it be Pulp Fiction, Boyz n tha Hood or Miller's Crossing (I understand only the first has even a chance).

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

PurpleHazel — Sat, 20 Jul 2019 03:17:09 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 07/20/2019 07:17

Fooling around with making lists, I found that 50 worked better with both genres. But I wouldn't discourage more. All right, if you're down with holding off on the horror poll, I guess I'll post a gangster movie poll early next week, unless someone voices a strong preference for war.

badseed wrote:

I will say that a Coppola film would no doubt be my #1 on both lists.

Yeah, a Coppola film is pretty much a lock for the #1 spot of either poll, with Goodfellas perhaps being the dark horse.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

badseed — Sat, 20 Jul 2019 01:45:48 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 07/20/2019 05:45

PurpleHazel wrote:

Doesn't this just prove that all genres are confusing? 😄 Neo-noir was super-confusing. Horror is proving to be way more ambiguous than I expected before I started thinking about a list.

Sounds like you're into me doing one of the polls. Which one do you prefer? Of course, I'm throwing this question out to anyone who's interested in either a gangster or war poll.

Then we can discuss Pineapple Express. :lol:

I feel like they're both relatively equal in my eyes when it comes to how bad I'd like to do them. Both seem like lists that I wouldn't initially think I can make a strong top 100 with, but the more I think about it the more I think it is possible. I will say that a Coppola film would no doubt be my #1 on both lists.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

PurpleHazel — Fri, 19 Jul 2019 17:00:28 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 07/19/2019 21:00

badseed wrote:

Both can be a bit confusing though. Lots of movies that aren't really considered gangster movies have more gangster activity than a lot of actual gangster movies. Pineapple Express for example. Then for war, are we doing just like modern wars or are old fashioned pre-artillery wars also included? What about movies that, while completely related to war, don't feature scenes of war (like a war trial film)? What about documentaries on war? What about fictional wars including but not limited to superhero wars?

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

badseed — Fri, 19 Jul 2019 14:59:19 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 07/19/2019 18:59

PurpleHazel wrote:

Sure, the more time to watch the merrier!

I was interested in hosting a poll. But I didn't come up with any ideas that would both generate enough interest and compel me. I considered doing a gangster movie one, but that's probably a bit too specific. After catching a few war movies on TCM during their D-Day Anniversary festival I considered a war one, but that's a genre that never seemed to arouse much interest here (and I felt the same way till I looked into it and saw the variety of films that could be eligible).

Will post more tomorrow.

I'm totally down for doing both of those polls. Both can be a bit confusing though. Lots of movies that aren't really considered gangster movies have more gangster activity than a lot of actual gangster movies. Pineapple Express for example. Then for war, are we doing just like modern wars or are old fashioned pre-artillery wars also included? What about movies that, while completely related to war, don't feature scenes of war (like a war trial film)? What about documentaries on war? What about fictional wars including but not limited to superhero wars?

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

PurpleHazel — Fri, 19 Jul 2019 05:04:48 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 07/19/2019 09:04

badseed wrote:

Alright guys, I'm gonna start the poll up on Monday. Nobody else seems interested in starting up a poll before then anyway, so why not start it as soon as possible to maximize interest?

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

badseed — Thu, 18 Jul 2019 02:23:25 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 07/18/2019 06:23

Alright guys, I'm gonna start the poll up on Monday. Why Monday? Because that's 100 days until Halloween eve. Nobody else seems interested in starting up a poll before then anyway, so why not start it as soon as possible to maximize interest? I want most of you to take your time and not feel rushed, but I'm gonna have my list ready and made public immediately after I start the poll so you guys can check it out for recommendations if you like. May even make it a top 200 or 250 since I have so many films at an 8 out of 10. I've been tinkering with my ratings on and off. Might be whittled down to just four 10 out 10s. Anyhow yeah just thought I'd mention that. Hope all is well. Go out to the movies if you can. Lots of big movies out now or coming in the fall. But try to check out the classics too. If you're a paying streamer scope out all the best stuff on what you've got, and if you can afford an extra 4.99 a month, Shudder has a wide variety of horror from all around the world. I believe they offer a free 7 day trial as well. Again, I can't stress how good their library is for such a low price; many of their titles are licensed by top notch releasing companies that sell many of those movies for $25-35 a pop (a lot of which I own which is why I don't currently have shudder but there's still a lot of good stuff even I need to see on there).

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

badseed — Fri, 12 Jul 2019 22:32:49 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 07/13/2019 02:32

StreetSpirit wrote:

I agree Under the Skin isn't hard sci-fi, but that doesn't automatically make it part-horror. I get what you're saying how surrealism suggests horror. But there were only a handful of surrealist scenes in the film, not enough to be horror. Those scenes weren't really "horror" anyway.

Just because there were only a couple really weird scenes doesn't mean that's all that was surreal. Surrealism isn't all about smoke and shadows and strangely uncomfortable object placement. If the entire concept of this film isn't surrealism I guess I interpreted it differently but almost nothing in that movie seems natural to me. It all felt like one long nightmare. Shit maybe I was on heavy hallucinogens watching it. Timeline seems right. I watched it like 3 times the first week I saw it. Whatever though, I'm not trying hard to convince anyone how I feel, I'm just reasoning my own logic against yours to convince myself whose side I'm on more than anything else.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

CA Dreamin — Fri, 12 Jul 2019 20:36:05 GMT

Author: CA Dreamin

Posted: 07/13/2019 00:36

badseed wrote:

One thing I think we haven't taken into account is the surrealism of the movie. Surreal films can be borderline because they're basically just confusing art movies...Basically you take these kind of movies, imagine if they were a dream. If it's more like a nightmare than a dream, it's horror. If it were hard sci-fi I might argue differently but with that lack of certainty and familiarity, you basically have either sci-fi adventure or sci-fi horror. It's not an adventure film, thus it fits the genre to me.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

badseed — Fri, 12 Jul 2019 18:40:41 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 07/12/2019 22:40

One thing I think we haven't taken into account is the surrealism of the movie. Surreal films can be borderline because they're basically just confusing art movies. Take Eraserhead. Definitely a conflict but not good vs evil. But due to the overall weirdness of the situation it's horror. Then again, Un Chien Andalou. Not horror, just as weird and creepy as Eraserhead, which I (and general consensus) believe is horror. Basically you take these kind of movies, imagine if they were a dream. If it's more like a nightmare than a dream, it's horror. If it were hard sci-fi I might argue differently but with that lack of certainty and familiarity, you basically have either sci-fi adventure or sci-fi horror. It's not an adventure film, thus it fits the genre to me.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

PurpleHazel — Fri, 12 Jul 2019 18:18:33 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 07/12/2019 22:18

StreetSpirit wrote:

Okay, so if she's the antagonist, then who is the protagonist? Nobody, cause there are no other developed characters. And I would say she elicits more than a "little sympathy." It's clear that she's an outcast on her home planet. As badseed said, she was quite lonely, lost, and detached. Yes, she lures people to their deaths, but not because she enjoys it, but because it's her duty, a duty she starts to resent around halfway through the film. Thus I don't see Under the Skin as a story of good vs. evil, with clearly defined good guys and villains, as we typically see in horror films. In addition, it lacks scariness, the body count is pretty low, there's no gore...there just aren't enough horror elements to earn the genre tag in my book.

I wasn't actually arguing it's a horror film. I'm pretty ambivalent about some of these SF films being horror. But I do think she's an antagonist who turns into a protagonist toward the end of the film. Not every film has a protagonist -- if protagonist is defined as someone who's more good than bad. She didn't elicit sympathy from me till near the end.

Quote:

As badseed said, she was quite lonely, lost, and detached.

Badseed didn't say she was lonely. Of course she's detached -- she's one of two and then one of her kind on an alien planet.

Quote:

Yes, she lures people to their deaths, but not because she enjoys it, but because it's her duty

A lot of horror "antagonists" kill because they have to or can't control themselves. Zombies eat human flesh because that's their sustenance -- they're not usually capable of emotions like enjoyment. Frankenstein in the original film kills out of either fear or not knowing his own strength. In a lot of monster and "animal attack" movies, the killing or violence comes from creatures following their instincts. If the animals are mutated then the only evil is nuclear bomb testing, pollution or experimentation, not the creatures themselves.

As badseed pointed out some horror movies don't have an antagonist, like Carnival of Souls, or the main character embodies both, as in Repulsion. I think Deneuve starts out as a protagonist and at the end of the film becomes an antagonist, but she can't help it because she's damaged from trauma.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

CA Dreamin — Fri, 12 Jul 2019 16:52:43 GMT

Author: CA Dreamin

Posted: 07/12/2019 20:52

Okay, so if she's the antagonist, then who is the protagonist? Nobody, cause there are no other developed characters. And I would say she elicits more than a "little sympathy." It's clear that she's an outcast on her home planet. As badseed said, she was quite lonely, lost, and detached. Yes, she lures people to their deaths, but not because she enjoys it, but because it's her duty, a duty she starts to resent around halfway through the film. Thus I don't see Under the Skin as a story of good vs. evil, with clearly defined good guys and villains, as we typically see in horror films. In addition, it lacks scariness, the body count is pretty low, there's no gore...there just aren't enough horror elements to earn the genre tag in my book.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

PurpleHazel — Tue, 9 Jul 2019 17:10:39 GMT

Author: PurpleHazel

Posted: 07/09/2019 21:10

To me Johansson and her motorcyclist accomplice are the antagonists. She lures men to their deaths and it's not because of their behavior toward her. In some ways she's like the Julia character in Hellraiser. Just because an antagonist elicits a little sympathy doesn't mean they're not an antagonist. Michael Moreland, the man who takes her in, is the most sympathetic (adult!) character.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

badseed — Tue, 9 Jul 2019 04:04:14 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 07/09/2019 08:04

StreetSpirit wrote:

Under the Skin isn't a horror film in my book because it's not very scary, and lacks a clear antagonist. Sure there is some creepiness and some disturbing imagery, but they're not frequent. The scene where the guy gets sucked into a wormhole is pretty unsettling but that's about it. At the same time, horrors almost always have a clear villain, usually a psycho human slasher, an alien or monster, or some kind of supernatural evil. But who or what is the villain in Under the Skin? The only logical answer is the alien played by Scar Jo, who at the same time is the one character we feel any sympathy for.

Off the top of my head, here's a list of horror films with no antagonist:

...

Damn. You might have sold me on that. I mean I do feel Scarlett is the villain but like you said, it's not like any sympathy is built towards anyone besides her. Maybe that baby. That part haunts me something savage...

How about a movie like Repulsion. Does Catherine Deneuve's own mental health play the villain?

What about Carnival of Souls? Spoiler alert: There's ghosts but they aren't "bad guys"

The thing those two films have in common is that they're psychological horror films in which the horror lies within the mystery behind the main character. I feel like Under the Skin falls into that category. Just because she isn't human doesn't take away from the psychological aspect. There are times where she appears to be so lost and detached. It's basically Carnival of Souls except *spoiler alert* she's an alien instead of a ghost.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

CA Dreamin — Tue, 9 Jul 2019 01:47:39 GMT

Author: CA Dreamin

Posted: 07/09/2019 05:47

badseed wrote:

Under the Skin, no pun intended, gets under my skin. I'm open to the idea of it possibly not being horror (it's a film that can be interpreted in different ways), but I'd need a paragraph or two of very reasonable convincing to convert me on that one.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

badseed — Wed, 3 Jul 2019 17:17:38 GMT

Author: badseed

Posted: 07/03/2019 21:17

Another film that I've questioned as horror in the past, I no longer question. That film is Salo, and even though I haven't watched it since my Criterion binging like 4 years ago, in the last year I've come to accept that it is indeed a horror film.

Another one, Deliverance. Not considered horror by hardly anyone. Why not? This I keep asking myself. How is that not scary? It's backwoods survival horror, not much different than The Hills Have Eyes or Wrong Turn, just less gory and over the top.

Re: Horror Films (General Discussion)

cestuneblague — Wed, 3 Jul 2019 10:20:12 GMT

Author: cestuneblague

Posted: 07/03/2019 14:20

I'm a slut for a good "Wish Upon" discussion