Best Ever Albums

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

CA Dreamin — Sun, 30 Aug 2020 10:13:03 GMT

Author: CA Dreamin

Posted: 08/30/2020 14:13

Spyglass wrote:

It could stem from anything, even though group mentality could post more common reasons among said group. Skinny mentioned his disdain for MC Hammer being a stain on true hip hop and likely justified the common belief with his analysis. It's a common belief among many haters that artists sell out themselves or the scene for popularity, which describes a very common hate for many edge-rock acts of the millenial age such as Nickelback, Creed and Korn. But again, this is one reason.

I'd say there's a fundamental difference between the hate Nickelback would receive and the hate Mayhem (or black metal in general) would receive, which has been suggested in this thread. Nickelback seemed like a group of posers who saw the grunge/post-grunge movement as a way to make money. And sure enough, they did. However this seems like the kind of hate that would wear off over time in the manner Skinny described in post #28. I think as we get older, we come to realize some people have made themselves rich by doing worse things than Nickelback. And at the end of the day, Nickelback never harmed anybody (that I know of). On the other hand, Mayhem and the black metal movement actually did cause harm. Black metal musicians and their followers burned down churches. That one drummer murdered a homosexual. I can certainly see how that would cause everlasting hate from adult Christians and homosexuals.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Spyglass — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 21:39:38 GMT

Author: Spyglass

Posted: 08/30/2020 01:39

CA Dreamin wrote:

Spyglass wrote:

RoundTheBend wrote:

Oh that's a good point. I almost try and block some of their poppier stuff out of my mind somehow. Other times I eat it up.

It's funny though - sometimes I get in the mood where that mega poppy stuff like I want to hold your hand is just so endearing and simple sounding which lends to some level of purity sounding. Now the lyric goes "I want to fuck all your friends drunk"...

A reflection on the diminishing innocence of man. That's another excellent example that ties right into both of our statements. How many modern hits aren't about fucking these days? These kiddie 60's songs are now deemed to be "too innocent," and so it's put in the same "recycle bin" as other beliefs in the average adult memory. Not many people these days actually follow simple phrases like "sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me," since offense is one of the biggest political issues these days. Adulthood has turned into an emotional feeling as opposed to its original status as a moral, and the disagreement of certain types of adulthood lead to a feeling of being challenged, so behavior in even the smallest things such as music gets turned into a maturity issue, with the exception to the adulthood rule likely being Disney songs. In some cases people feel obligated to like certain things and avoid underground works not only because of some cheap acceptance belief tying into the popularity of it all, but because adult content is the easy way into adulthood for anybody. NC-17 films. Methamphetamine. Your "laid" count. Screw morality when you can screw a human being, right? The biggest hit songs can easily reflect the common emotions and desires of modern man. And yes, this doesn't always tie-in with personalities, which is why so many black metal fans are not guilty of murder or pyromania in opposition to the staples of the early culture (watch Lords of Chaos). But those songs tie-in closer to people with severe issues against certain types of people, usually religious ones. For the common desires of romance, lust and sex, it's much easier to relate. And the more you allow certain messages on the radio, the more people believe in them. The hilarious thing is that this world has become exactly what our grandparents warned our parents about. We're all fucked figuratively and literally.

I think it's worth noting many songs from the 60s were about drugs and sex, granted they were usually a lot more subtle than this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4TFiqFEVxo

But anyway, to tie this back to the original topic, are you suggesting "hating" music doesn't stem from the music itself, but rather the specific content of the lyrics? I find that an intriguing idea. I agree with what Skinny said earlier (post #28 ) about hate being a mainly a youth thing. When we're young, we may hate some big-name artists, but that turns into indifference as we age. However I can see how grown-ups would hate certain music that flies directly in opposition with their moral code, music that encourages violence, drug use, and sex, etc. Your Mayhem/Lords of Chaos example fits into this idea.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

RoundTheBend — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 20:02:33 GMT

Author: RoundTheBend

Posted: 08/30/2020 00:02

#InsaneClownPosse4Lyfe
#magnets

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

CA Dreamin — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 20:00:12 GMT

Author: CA Dreamin

Posted: 08/30/2020 00:00

Spyglass wrote:

RoundTheBend wrote:

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

RoundTheBend — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 19:57:33 GMT

Author: RoundTheBend

Posted: 08/29/2020 23:57

🤣

By the way I didn't mean that nobody was impure before 1967... 🤣

Dogmatic viewpoints are so boring. Since when was the world black and white?

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Tha1ChiefRocka — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 17:54:07 GMT

Author: Tha1ChiefRocka

Posted: 08/29/2020 21:54

Surprise!

Link

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

pctrooper — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 17:35:17 GMT

Author: pctrooper

Posted: 08/29/2020 21:35

Spyglass wrote:

A lot of modern people could easily dislike The Beatles because of their cheesy 60's sound. I remember that when I was younger their songs felt like something off of Dragon Tales. But I was still listening to music like System of a Down back then, even though I still loved softer songs like "Save Room." If people are blocking themselves from 60's music, they won't gather a good grasp on how the Beatles paved so many new directions for pop artists to take, kind of like how The Clash was a major influence on many new forms of punk.

I love the Dragon Tales song! I came to appreciate The Beatles after listening to my favorite bands like Genesis, PInk Floyd, and Yes when I was younger. Learning to detect the way the Beatles influenced them helped me appreciate their music, I think.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Spyglass — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 17:01:56 GMT

Author: Spyglass

Posted: 08/29/2020 21:01

Skinny wrote:

I love Lysol as much as the next guy, but using Buzz Osborne as a political touchstone is laughable.

It's not so much "using him as a political touchstone" as much as using him as an example of how things can change overtime.

baystateoftheart wrote:

Hmm thinking about world problems of the modern age, I'd say climate change in the long term, and pandemic / economic collapse in the short term. But to each their own I suppose... This phase of the discussion should probably move to the politics & religion section.

I should have clarified that it's the biggest social issue as far as personal relationships and activity go. At least IMO.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

baystateoftheart — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 16:29:26 GMT

Author: baystateoftheart

Posted: 08/29/2020 20:29

Spyglass wrote:

But the biggest issue of the modern age is the confusion of honest mistakes with pure evil

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Skinny — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 16:19:46 GMT

Author: Skinny

Posted: 08/29/2020 20:19

I love Lysol as much as the next guy, but using Buzz Osborne as a political touchstone is laughable.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Spyglass — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 15:01:19 GMT

Author: Spyglass

Posted: 08/29/2020 19:01

NewsFromHome wrote:

I miss the innocence of the 1300's when my warring nomadic tribe would build a pile of human skeletons ten feet tall and then we'd all fuck in front of it.

I think it's a cycle. I mean, obviously it's not like we're all evil one century and then good in the other, but as new generations are born new morale codes become common. And the more we let go of something the more likely it is to crash, like a political interpretation of Sodom and Gomorrah. The media these days is mostly liberal (at least in the US), but who knows? In two generations is could be mostly conservative, but both sides of the political spectrum will have morphed into something largely different from what we believe. Even Buzz Osborne, a "classical liberal," doesn't believe in a lot of the things going on today. His version of liberalism is very different from today's standards because his version of liberalism was more common back then.

But the biggest issue of the modern age is the confusion of honest mistakes with pure evil, which also ties into the feeling of being challenged. This issue also gets very political, which is why I consider myself similar to Buzzo.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 14:53:16 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 08/29/2020 18:53

Spyglass wrote:

A reflection on the diminishing innocence of man.

I miss the innocence of the 1300's when my warring nomadic tribe would build a pile of human skeletons ten feet tall and then we'd all fuck in front of it.

Okay but that argument is moral panic-y to the point where I'd argue it's ahistorical.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

baystateoftheart — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 14:42:43 GMT

Author: baystateoftheart

Posted: 08/29/2020 18:42

Spyglass wrote:

RoundTheBend wrote:

Damn, really makes you think. We truly do live in a society.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Spyglass — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 14:26:13 GMT

Author: Spyglass

Posted: 08/29/2020 18:26

RoundTheBend wrote:

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

RoundTheBend — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 13:10:58 GMT

Author: RoundTheBend

Posted: 08/29/2020 17:10

Spyglass wrote:

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Spyglass — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 12:56:10 GMT

Author: Spyglass

Posted: 08/29/2020 16:56

A lot of modern people could easily dislike The Beatles because of their cheesy 60's sound. I remember that when I was younger their songs felt like something off of Dragon Tales. But I was still listening to music like System of a Down back then, even though I still loved softer songs like "Save Room." If people are blocking themselves from 60's music, they won't gather a good grasp on how the Beatles paved so many new directions for pop artists to take, kind of like how The Clash was a major influence on many new forms of punk.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

RoundTheBend — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 12:26:44 GMT

Author: RoundTheBend

Posted: 08/29/2020 16:26

craola wrote:

perhaps video finally done and killed the radio star.

i definitely wouldn't underrate those buskers.

🤣 Indeed.

Also yeah, honestly one of my favorite artists is a Santa Monica Pier busker (Elian Quesada)... one of my favorite haunts back when I lived in LA. Pretty awesome story about making a better living than I do now as a busker. I gotta change my priorities (and not suck...). Also anyone familiar with The Three Penny Opera or "busking" organizations in Europe - whole community who makes a living off it. I'm so vanilla it even makes Mitt Romney sick... 🤣
https://open.spotify.com/album/5f8dB5lYoeoeah5oweVjNP?si=monmO7GTTJ6JsiPTytle_Q

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

RoundTheBend — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 12:15:20 GMT

Author: RoundTheBend

Posted: 08/29/2020 16:15

Skinny wrote:

Whilst I don't necessarily disagree with this in theory, I'm not sure you picked the best contemporaneous acts to help prove your point. You could maybe argue that they all dabbled in psychedelia - although by my reckoning The Velvet Underground hewed too much to their urban surroundings, albeit in ways that were considered and abstract, to really be lumped in with the 'psychedelic rock' crowd - but three of the four artists you named (including The Velvets) were noticeably harder-edged and, for want of a more tangible descriptor, more dangerous. Hendrix's playing was much rawer, and drew more obviously on the blues; The Doors really relied on Morrison's cult of personality, and their music contained a primal thump that I've never associated with The Beatles; lastly, The Velvet Underground put out music that was decidedly lo-fi and gritty, a world away from the large-scale sonic masterpieces that The Beatles (and, at times, The Beach Boys) set out to produce.

I actually prefer The Beatles to at least two of the acts you mentioned (Hendrix and The Doors), but it's fairly easy to see why somebody might like those artists and still dislike The Beatles, because there are huge stylistic differences between them. Whilst I don't deny that a small number of people overstate their dislike of The Beatles in the name of contrarianism (or even 'hipsterism'), I think that the idea that any Hendrix fan must also appreciate The Beatles is fundamentally flawed and relies on an underlying belief that The Beatles were an *objectively* good band who made *objectively* good music, which is a concept I simply cannot get behind. There are virtually no Beatles albums that don't contain a handful of songs that I genuinely can't stand, while I adore the likes of Pet Sounds and Forever Changes, so for me it's not too much of a stretch to imagine somebody who likes The Beatles' peers but not The Beatles themselves.

That said, I'm pretty distrustful of anybody generally who says they can't find a single Beatles song that they like. Life without 'I'm Only Sleeping' or 'Here, There and Everywhere' or 'A Day in the Life' would be a whole lot poorer.

Totally fair - I suppose the way I portrayed that (although I didn't mean to) is that if you like any of those groups you must like the Beatles, which wasn't exactly what I was going for, but totally get that's what got communicated. You also bring up salient points on why they wouldn't. I suppose I look at it as sure, you might like one of those artists one over the other, but to put any one of them in the garbage pile whilst putting any of the others on the greatest pedestal just never made sense to me. Like if you just hated all those artists, then I'd be like, oh that makes sense that all are garbage... you are more a Britney Spears type or more a Mahler type (hehe - sorry just what came to mind based on people I know who'd rather not listen to any of those groups).

But thanks for the clear reply/logical points. I suppose I need to give more credit to the differences... it's sometimes hard to separate for me things that don't make much of a difference (being ok with differences and celebrating each of those artists greatest strengths as more or less all GREAT/best of their kind), but that those differences are grossly important to others. I am after all the center of my universe... 🤣

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

RoundTheBend — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 12:06:33 GMT

Author: RoundTheBend

Posted: 08/29/2020 16:06

pctrooper wrote:

What is the most annoying Beatles song everyone? I'm not sure off the top of my head but I always thought Taxman was irritating. (Overall I like the Beatles quite a bit, though)>

Easily Run For Your Life (which is a pity because Rubber Soul is pretty fantastic otherwise). Even as a Beatles fanboi, I skip it basically every time (sometimes I'm not close enough to the record player... rrrrrruuuuunnnnnn... hehe).

I freaking love taxman, likely mostly due to the bass line and then that guitar solo is amazing. I dig beats like that. But I can see how vocally it could be annoying, but that's kinda the point of the song - venting frustration of taxes... it's supposed to sound upsetting/frustrated. Then again, some of the simplistic nature, I could see how that gets old quick and maybe that's what you hate about it, which is totally fair.

Re: Acts everyone hates except you

Skinny — Sat, 29 Aug 2020 04:19:16 GMT

Author: Skinny

Posted: 08/29/2020 08:19

Spyglass wrote:

Edit: for some reason MC Hammer gets slack these days?

MC Hammer always got shit - and rightfully so, too - for taking a relatively nascent genre and transparently exploiting it for commercial purposes. Whilst anyone is entitled to eschew art in favour of commerce under our current free market hegemony, it doesn't make it any less galling when it happens. Hip-hop was still attempting to be taken seriously, still finding a way to break free from the narrative that it was a novelty genre or a passing fad (despite having already survived for a decade) when this guy came along crab-strutting in gap year pantaloons and talking about nothing, potentially sanitising rap music in the eyes of some parents whilst simultaneously helping to cement its status as a frilly "artform" of no real consequence. He's no better than Vanilla Ice or Poochie from The Simpsons, and he deserves to be consigned to garbage bin of history.