Best Ever Albums

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Facetious — Mon, 20 Feb 2012 05:18:46 GMT

Author: Facetious

Posted: 02/20/2012 10:18

Just copy Eggman/Walrus/Taxman's chart.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Anonymous — Sun, 19 Feb 2012 10:46:17 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 02/19/2012 15:46

Haven't started this yet because I don't know the right way to go about it. Maybe I should concentrating on getting every album ever first 🤔 Have some rough notes though.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Necharsian — Fri, 17 Feb 2012 13:01:22 GMT

Author: Necharsian

Posted: 02/17/2012 18:01

Just copy my chart.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Mr. Shankly — Fri, 17 Feb 2012 10:43:34 GMT

Author: Mr. Shankly

Posted: 02/17/2012 15:43

Just copy Naples' chart. 😜

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

gussteivi — Fri, 17 Feb 2012 06:02:47 GMT

Author: gussteivi

Posted: 02/17/2012 11:02

Here we go again...

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Xavygravy — Fri, 17 Feb 2012 04:18:19 GMT

Author: Xavygravy

Posted: 02/17/2012 09:18

Rolling Stone have done the best 'objective' charts that I know of (500 Greatest Albums/Songs)
I think what they did was they collected a large group of musicians, music critics, and music industry people from all types of genres and ages to make a list of what they think the 50 greatest albums are, with some kind of criteria to take into consideration such as significance, influence, etc.
And then these were assigned scores like they are on BEA and put into order.
Collectively, this makes up an "objective" chart.

As hard as you try to make one yourself, it won't be the same as a collection of those who lived through the times when the albums were released and ranking their greatness.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

19loveless91 — Thu, 16 Feb 2012 17:44:32 GMT

Author: 19loveless91

Posted: 02/16/2012 22:44

In order to make an "objective" chart, you would first have to agree on which things make an album great (is it originality, melodic aspect, complexity, concept, popularity ...). Even when you decide on those, you would probably have trouble "researching" these things in an objective way, because you probably have some genre preference + it's probably impossible to say, for example, which album is "more original than the other" (most people don't have that kind of musical knowledge to say that for sure... Even those people here, that are rating thousands of albums), or even worse, which one has a better "concept" than other, because it will sooner or later become a matter of your subjective taste.

Another way of an "objective" chart is to go by public's (and critics) opinion to determine what makes quality. But the problem here is, if you look at it, the overall BEA chart is already an example of such a chart, and it would generally make no sense to make yours that way, because it's most likely gonna end up with similar albums, only in a different order, according to (again) your subjective taste.

Bottom line; please don't do that. The point of a site like BEA is that it's a congregation of each person's individual taste, and there's no point of putting your version of such a chart. Just do your favourites and contribute to the site the way it was meant. Help your favourite, if not "objectively" great albums.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Necharsian — Thu, 16 Feb 2012 17:10:31 GMT

Author: Necharsian

Posted: 02/16/2012 22:10

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

Necharsian wrote:

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

If all people on this site were 100% subjective, the overall chart would in time be 100% objective. But people aren't 100% subjective.

😕 What?

Also:

There is no such thing as an objective chart. Couldn't happen. Objectivity in regards to musical greatness cannot happen. Sorry.

Peoples' individual choices would sum up the ¨objective¨ choices. Or what did you not understand?

I guess I just don't agree with that at all. People are always subjective when it comes to music, but that doesn't mean that adding all of them up is objective. The overall chart is as subjective as anyones' individual chart.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Mother Nature's Son — Thu, 16 Feb 2012 17:02:10 GMT

Author: Mother Nature's Son

Posted: 02/16/2012 22:02

Necharsian wrote:

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

If all people on this site were 100% subjective, the overall chart would in time be 100% objective. But people aren't 100% subjective.

😕 What?

Also:

There is no such thing as an objective chart. Couldn't happen. Objectivity in regards to musical greatness cannot happen. Sorry.

Peoples' individual choices would sum up the ¨objective¨ choices. Or what did you not understand?

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

RoundTheBend — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 20:55:58 GMT

Author: RoundTheBend

Posted: 02/16/2012 01:55

an_outlaw wrote:

Anyway, recently I have been thinking about creating my own list like this. Sort of a homage to those lists.

If you want something objective, but gives tribute to all those lists out there, and doesn't influence you subjectively maybe give this a try if you haven't already. I think this site is the list of all list possibilities, in my opinion.

Anyways, have you played around with the customize features under the overall tab? I think it can make awesome lists right at your finger tips. It already includes 100s of critical lists, plus all of BEA. I like to isolate it only to the critics to see that view and then I like to see what BEA thinks by taking all of the critics lists off. It is a nice tool as well if you just want to isolate a certain decade or what have you.

You may have already done this a million times, but I think that is the best way to get a list that pays homage to all the already ranked albums, and it would be somewhat less subjective.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Necharsian — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 19:13:38 GMT

Author: Necharsian

Posted: 02/16/2012 00:13

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

If all people on this site were 100% subjective, the overall chart would in time be 100% objective. But people aren't 100% subjective.

😕 What?

Also:

There is no such thing as an objective chart. Couldn't happen. Objectivity in regards to musical greatness cannot happen. Sorry.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Anonymous — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 18:00:41 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 02/15/2012 23:00

mancsoulsister wrote:

I don't think I could make an 'objective' chart.

I would not be able to put an album on a chart if I don't personally like it, just because a bunch of other people think it is good. What makes their opinions any more or less valid than mine? Maybe they haven't heard album x that I love so don't know how great it is? Do I really care what other people think?

I would much rather put my name to what I like and look at other specific sites or publications for a more 'accepted norm'. I tend to browse charts/chart sites for albums I don't know and for other ideas. I know the accepted top 100 and know what bits of it I like and what I don't so am not really interested in exploring that further.

I would say stick to your own objective chart as it is personal and says something about you! :D

Thanks 😄 I'll keep my chart and go through with this other idea though. I have been entertaining for quite a while now and writing it has me thinking I should at least try. I'm writing it on paper and I'll post it on a thread if I ever complete it.

I won't be putting albums I dislike. There really isn't a lot I dislike right now I think so I might be able to get by.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Anonymous — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 17:32:34 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 02/15/2012 22:32

Seeing as music is subjective and not objective, I can't see what you are trying to a accomplish, I suppose you could make list of the most popular/critically acclaimed albums. However that would be an incredibly boring chart and only worthwhile doing if you think the objective greatest albums fitted that criteria

Also I think someone made that chart

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Mother Nature's Son — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 17:03:17 GMT

Author: Mother Nature's Son

Posted: 02/15/2012 22:03

mancsoulsister wrote:

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

Yes, thematic lists, or perhaps year charts, would clearly make this problem better. And don't feel guilty at all. Even though obscure choices aren't completely honest, they are definitely more interesting to see than the same 100 albums you see in every chart.

Why aren't 'obscure choices completely honest'?

Not everyone likes the same things, so what is 'obscure' to one person, is someone elses favourite. I don't think you can say because you don't know an album or it isn't totally mainstream 'everyone likes' that it is somehow dishonest!!!

I'm sorry. I wasn't clear enough. You're totally right that obscure choices aren't necessarily dishonest. What I meant was the albums that people put on charts, ONLY because the mainstream ¨doesn't like¨ it. To make the chart look more personal/special.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Anonymous — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 16:52:29 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 02/15/2012 21:52

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Mother Nature's Son — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 16:47:26 GMT

Author: Mother Nature's Son

Posted: 02/15/2012 21:47

Robert Anton Wilson wrote:

Well ... I am sort of guilty of that one but I am not doing it for the purpose of making it more spectacular but definitely for the purpose of making it more interesting. I think the addition of thematic lists will make this less of a problem by allowing us to make interesting recommendations without needing to put the album we want to push on a best ever chart.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Anonymous — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 16:26:25 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 02/15/2012 21:26

Robert Anton Wilson wrote:

Sgt Pepper: Truly the first ever "best ever" pop album that made albums a worthy media in and of themselves.

Kind of Blue (Miles Davis): Before pop/rock, jazz dominated album sales even though the idea of a jazz album is a bit of an oxymoron with jazz being about improvisation and fluid structures and never doing the same thing twice. Kind of Blue proved that even though jazz albums are not as truly jazz as actual performances they are a worthy commodity and lord did many jazz album followed improvisation or not

Pet Sounds: the Beach Boys: .

Thriller by Michael Jackson: The ultimate demonstration of how much bigger one album can be to anything which is its contemporary. You think you made it big, here is how big you have to make it before people say you couldn't have done it bigger.

Like a Virgin, Madonna: the proof that when making it big talent and substance is optional. A very reductive album but it changed the face of female pop/rock forever.

Dark Side of the Moon: The proof that sometimes success is demonstrated by the test of time rather than by the greatest "box office" success.

Exile on Main Street Proof that the underlying art which is necessary to make an album can be disassociated from the necessary catchyness and popularity necessary for making a single.

OK Computer, Radiohead: Proof that it can still be done within a somewhat rock realm (as opposed to hip hop or pop)

Tommy, The Who: The first hugely popular rock opera/album elaborate enough to made into a movie.

The only one that might still deserve to be included is either Born to Run or Nebraska by Bruce but I am not sure.

... Anything beyond is clearly subjective ...

Great stuff 😄 And I have listened to all of them apart from the Madonna one. Might have to give that a go.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Robert Anton Wilson — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 16:16:49 GMT

Author: Robert Anton Wilson

Posted: 02/15/2012 21:16

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

If all people on this site were 100% subjective, the overall chart would in time be 100% objective. But people aren't 100% subjective ... If people didn't care about others opinions, then the overall chart would be objective.

Funny you should say that. Statistically speaking, you are totally right. Wanting to make it objective actually makes it less objective.

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

If people didn't put weird albums on their chart just to make it more spectacular and interesting

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Anonymous — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 16:09:56 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 02/15/2012 21:09

Mother Nature's Son wrote:

If all people on this site were 100% subjective, the overall chart would in time be 100% objective. But people aren't 100% subjective.

If people didn't put weird albums on their chart just to make it more spectacular and interesting, if people didn't put too obvious choices on, even though they don't like them, just to be ¨safe¨.. If people didn't care about others opinions, then the overall chart would be objective.

Great points raised there 😄

I should mention before we go further that this idea will not be posted as my chart but will end up on a thread here and notebook elsewhere.

Re: The "objective" greatest and best albums list?

Anonymous — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 16:09:35 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 02/15/2012 21:09

I don't think I could make an 'objective' chart.

I would not be able to put an album on a chart if I don't personally like it, just because a bunch of other people think it is good. What makes their opinions any more or less valid than mine? Maybe they haven't heard album x that I love so don't know how great it is? Do I really care what other people think?

I would much rather put my name to what I like and look at other specific sites or publications for a more 'accepted norm'. I tend to browse charts/chart sites for albums I don't know and for other ideas. I know the accepted top 100 and know what bits of it I like and what I don't so am not really interested in exploring that further.

I would say stick to your own objective chart as it is personal and says something about you! 😁