Best Ever Albums

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

hairymarx1 — Tue, 5 Jun 2012 00:04:06 GMT

Author: hairymarx1

Posted: 06/05/2012 04:04

noWaxJim wrote:

Sorry to the person who wrote this obviously well-meaning descriptive diatribe, but I've got a fair few bones to pick with it:

1. Pub-rock was NOT "a kind of sub-genre of punk". It predated punk, but in doing so gave the burgeoning punk bands not only a ready-made working class audience (the ones who got into Dr. Feelgood, Kilburn & The High Roads, Ducks Deluxe, Eddie & The Hot Rods, etc, because they were bored of stadium gigs and prog) but the hi-energy, basic musical form it needed to connect to the 'bored teenagers' that society and the music industry had forgotton about (1976 was the year of The Wurzels and Disco Duck, just to remind you). When punk 'exploded' c.late '76, pub rock virtually died a death overnight in all but the pubs that created the scene in the first place (Tally Ho, Hope and Anchor, Nashville - which very quickly became a punk venue). To this end your dating of pub-rock as being 76-79 is way out - try more like 72-76. In fact, you could probably argue that Pub Rock as a going concern ended the day Joe Strummer walked out the 101er's and joined The Clash.

2. The Television Personalities are BY NO MEANS a pub-rock band. Dan Treacy was 16 at the height of pub rock. I doubt if he'd have been allowed in to play. I would also wager that by being perhaps one of the most satirical bands of the last 30-35 years the TV Personalities are full of originality. Which song of theirs do you think most resembles pub-rock, whilst we're on the subject?

3. Whilst we're talking about originality, I'd go further to say that Wilko Johnson's (Dr. Feelgood) staccato guitar chops were unlike anything else around at the time (he doesn't use a pick). True - the songs were samey and on the whole covers or blues-based, but in terms of style and musicianship Johnson (and Brilleaux, by looking like a dirty sod that'd knock you senseless if you tried to pick a fight with him) gave the pub rock scene some gusto, stage presence and crucially potential for audience interaction (spitting, heckling, beer bottles being chucked at the drummer) that tapped directly into the energy that later manifested itself in punk. C.F video below. It's certainly no "Milk And Alcohol".

Link

4. Elvis Costello may have started in a Pub Rock band called Flip City, but I'd say This Year's Model was more New Wave than pub or punkrock. Lip Service and Hand in Hand are definitely the case here, and if you call a track like The Beat pub-rock you may as well say the same for Psycho Killer.

I also don't think that Costello is over-rated, at least not his early LPs (I actually quite like This Year's Model - it's a fun little record, but nothing earth-shattering). But I've got no right to argue with you on a question of individual taste and opinion.

Just where you've got your facts wrong.

Thanks for the corrections. That was very informative. I accept that pub rock predated punk rock but wouldn't you say from about 1976 the genres - at least to some extent- overlapped? I remember the pub rock scene was still vibrant well into the punk scene which is why I partly mentioned the TV Personalities (more about them to follow).

Punk rock didn't totally displace pub rock but yes it did impact upon it greatly. For example, I remember bands like The Stranglers and X Ray Spex playing the Hope before they hit the big time of TOTPs.

I would argue that what links the bands of pub rock is not merely the nature of music, subject matter and compositional content, but other factors like style of delivery and the 'amateurish' playing. None of these things I would suggest are mutually exclusive to one another.

I would say that the TV Personalties were amateurs and that as far as aesthetics were concerned, were close to the whimsy and imagery of say Syd Barrett (not just because they included his name in one of their songs) but were lacking in the music and songwriting department.

The same can be said for a band like The Only Ones. On the other end of the scale, a band like The Soft Boys, although thematically and aesthetically tied to both the TV Personalities and The Only Ones, were far more musically accomplished than those bands.

Some people (myself included), would argue that The Soft Boys were not a pub rock band because they were too subtle, sophisticated and original to be labelled as such, whilst others would say that they were. In that sense, these kinds of judgements, I would contend, are ultimately subjective.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Jimmy Dread — Mon, 4 Jun 2012 16:59:04 GMT

Author: Jimmy Dread

Posted: 06/04/2012 20:59

hairymarx1 wrote:

Pub rock is a kind of sub-genre of punk in terms of the politics but with more emphasis on song craft that is less prone to the whims of fashion that typifies the former. Pub-rock was closely related to an underground scene specific to the UK, particularly London and its suburbs from about 1976-79. Out of this scene emerged bands that went on be famous nationally and some internationally.

A common thread linking the pub (ie garage) scene was the aesthetic of many of the bands concerned which was mainly sixties orientated with elements of punk rock and blues/mod offshoots. Groups often associated as pub-rock artists include Graham Parker and the Rumour, Eddie And The Hot Rods, Dr Feelgood, Nick Lowe, TV Personalities, Joe Jackson, Dire Straits and, of course, Elvis Costello.

What connects all of these artists is their lack of originality. Granted Costello was arguably more competent than many of his contemporaries but, like them, he nevertheless endorsed the aesthetic of Tin Pan Alley. In this sense Costello's music was hardly representative of any kind of departure away from the bands of the Merseybeat era.

Like many of his pub-rock contemporaries, Costello's art was highly ambiguous in that on the one hand it attacked the establishment politically, but on the other hand the music was deeply conservative and unoriginal. As with a band like the Jam, this separated Costello from many of his more hard-edged punk contemporaries.

I think that Costello is one of the most overrated artists there is.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

kidamnesiac — Sun, 3 Jun 2012 22:33:04 GMT

Author: kidamnesiac

Posted: 06/04/2012 02:33

living in paradise is the best song, the counting crows based all of their sound on this song

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Captain_Dude — Sun, 3 Jun 2012 20:24:21 GMT

Author: Captain_Dude

Posted: 06/04/2012 00:24

Love it, love it, love it. Awesome album.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

RFNAPLES — Sun, 3 Jun 2012 18:17:15 GMT

Author: RFNAPLES

Posted: 06/03/2012 22:17

Best track: (I Don't Want To Go To) Chelsea

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Norman Bates — Sun, 3 Jun 2012 01:44:55 GMT

Author: Norman Bates

Posted: 06/03/2012 05:44

hairymarx1 wrote:

Groups often associated as pub-rock artists include Graham Parker and the Rumour, Eddie And The Hot Rods, Dr Feelgood, Nick Lowe, TV Personalities, Joe Jackson, Dire Straits and, of course, Elvis Costello.

I'd have added the excellent Ian Dury, most early Stiff Records actually.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Norman Bates — Sun, 3 Jun 2012 01:43:37 GMT

Author: Norman Bates

Posted: 06/03/2012 05:43

junodog4 wrote:

Elvis Costello at his most fun... Well done!

My opinion exactly. Great record.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

hairymarx1 — Sun, 3 Jun 2012 00:59:16 GMT

Author: hairymarx1

Posted: 06/03/2012 04:59

an_outlaw wrote:

What makes something "Pub rock"? I have heard that term thrown artists who are much different than Elvis Costello yet it is always a bad remark. What bands or artists would qualify as this?

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

BrilliantDisguise — Sat, 2 Jun 2012 19:14:13 GMT

Author: BrilliantDisguise

Posted: 06/02/2012 23:14

Love Elvis Costello and love this album. Favorite song is Pump It Up.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

ffudnebbuh — Sat, 2 Jun 2012 09:35:08 GMT

Author: ffudnebbuh

Posted: 06/02/2012 13:35

Love this album (Columbia PC 35331) still have the promo version of this and the 6 foot tall stand up promo that the Columbia salesman gave us. "No Action" is my fav song.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Anonymous — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:59:01 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 06/02/2012 03:59

Mr. Shankly wrote:

OK. So you're not denigrating Elvis, you're just in that camp. Fair enough. To me though, the Attractions really took Elvis Costello's music to the next level. They're really an underrated backing group. They're right up there with the E St Band, for example, for me.

Anyway, I just glanced at your chart, and it would appear you like the artsy stuff more. Pop/ rock as you call it, isn't really your thing.

Well, to be fair these are the only Costello albums I've bothered to hear. I just prefer the songs on My aim is true, and keyboards on this years model push it towards new wavey stuff which bugs me. Theres nothing awfull about it though, actually you've got me listening to it and rating might have to go up....

and yeah, my taste is consumed with ugly noise and abstract weirdness. I wouldn't say pop rock isn't my thing, Its just one of many things, like anything its limiting after a while. I try and cover of as much music as I can. Always looking for the new. I do have Eels, The Clash and Tv on the Radio in my top ten, all fairly pop and melodic (TVOTR perhaps less so).

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Facetious — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:42:05 GMT

Author: Facetious

Posted: 06/02/2012 03:42

Mr. Shankly wrote:

^ This.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Mr. Shankly — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:40:33 GMT

Author: Mr. Shankly

Posted: 06/02/2012 03:40

Yourselfisntsteam wrote:

My Aim is True :lol:

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Anonymous — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:37:24 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 06/02/2012 03:37

Mr. Shankly wrote:

Really? What do you consider above average pop /rock?

My Aim is True 🤣

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Mr. Shankly — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:36:51 GMT

Author: Mr. Shankly

Posted: 06/02/2012 03:36

Yourselfisntsteam wrote:

Fairly average pop-rock. I don't mind Elvis Costello, but I'll always listen to My Aim is True over this.

Really? What do you consider above average pop /rock?

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Facetious — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:32:57 GMT

Author: Facetious

Posted: 06/02/2012 03:32

Yourselfisntsteam wrote:

Fairly average pop-rock. I don't mind Elvis Costello, but I'll always listen to My Aim is True over this.

LOL For the first time, I disagree with you COMPLETELY.

My Aim is True is fairly average, and I'll always listen to This Year's Model over it.

No, wait, both are brilliant. 😜

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Anonymous — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:31:06 GMT

Author: Anonymous

Posted: 06/02/2012 03:31

Fairly average pop-rock. I don't mind Elvis Costello, but I'll always listen to My Aim is True over this.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Facetious — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:25:16 GMT

Author: Facetious

Posted: 06/02/2012 03:25

This album rules.

Not in my top 100, but comes close.

85/100

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

ProfessorSquid — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 22:03:44 GMT

Author: ProfessorSquid

Posted: 06/02/2012 02:03

Great point, Shankly. Oasis' Morning Glory, their highest ranked, is the 34th best album of all time and this, Costello's highest ranked record, comes in at 247. I have no problem with Oasis, but that is a gross disparity.

Re: Album of the day (#563): This Year's Model by Elvis Costello

Mr. Shankly — Fri, 1 Jun 2012 21:22:01 GMT

Author: Mr. Shankly

Posted: 06/02/2012 01:22

Applerill wrote:

Such a fun record. CJ and I often put this on when waiting for dates 😎

That's an interesting thing to say, since most of the lyrical content is not exactly lovey dovey or romantic April in Paris kind of fare. In fact, Elvis was writing a lot of angry, bitter songs about female characters that had either scorned him or he wasn't thinking too highly of at the time. Now, if you get stood up or your significant other cheats on you, I'd say This Year's Model would be the perfect soundtrack then.

As for me, I love this album! It's full of angst, phenomenal, well-crafted tunes that rock hard with the help of the Attractions, and I think it's Elvis's best. I also think he is way underrated and overlooked on BEA, a weird anomaly I've never understood. When it comes to songwriting as an art form, he's in an elite group and more people should recognize that fact. He's one my heroes. 😎

I would challenge anyone who thinks Oasis (who is ranked much higher on BEA) is great, to delve into Elvis Costello's back catalog for a month or two. Unless you have unredeemingly horrible taste, you should see and hear a vast difference between the two.