|
View previous topic :: View next topic
|
|
| Author |
Message |
Grzywa
Gender: Male
Location: Polska
|
- #11
- Posted: 05/06/2016 09:39
- Post subject:
|
| Norman Bates wrote: | All this doesn't prove that communism is "wrong in nature" in any way.
You'd also have to prove your examples are valid examples of "communism", by which I mean that most of your examples (the ones I know a little about at least) are actually examples of state capitalism gone very wrong indeed (but how could it be otherwise? Capitalism has gone wrong everywhere it's been tried, and therefore is wrong in nature  ). |
Labels, labels... I'm afraid that what you refer to as state capitalism is universally referred to as practical applications of communism, but if that works better for you, we might as well speak of state capitalism, no problem.
Going back to my question, can you point out any examples of successful communist countries ? Like real communist countries ?
_________________
Always shouts out something obscene
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
|
|
Norman Bates
Gender: Male
Age: 51
Location: Paris, France
|
- #12
- Posted: 05/06/2016 09:45
- Post subject:
|
| Grzywa wrote: |
Going back to my question, can you point out any examples of successful communist countries ? Like real communist countries ? |
I can't, and my take on why not is that socialism can only work if the dictatorship of the proletariat, and the overhaul of the means and tools of production by the workers, is achieved internationally. Countries and borders have no meaning to me. One "communist" country isolated in an ultracapitalist network is doomed.
I can't give you any example of successful, or unbsuccessful, "communist" country, because communism has never been achieved.
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
Muslim-Bigfoot
Gender: Male
Age: 33
Location: Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch
|
- #13
- Posted: 05/06/2016 12:15
- Post subject:
|
Engel's answer to the 19th question here is very relevant today. When I first read this it was very interesting because I independently thought the same thing and didn't know they had the same idea.[/url]
_________________
"I feel like for the last two years there’s been sort of a sonic evolution happening and I’ve been experimenting more and more."
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
alelsupreme
Awful.
Gender: Male
Age: 27
|
- #14
- Posted: 05/06/2016 12:37
- Post subject:
|
| meccalecca wrote: | One of the main questions raised at the end of the film is "where does North Korea get the money to stay afloat?"
It appears that China is keeping them afloat, because North Korea certainly cannot support itself. |
Basically. Without China's funds NK would collapse within months, its not agriculturally self-sufficient and its industry is woefully outdated.
| benpaco wrote: | | Also, and excuse me if I'm selectively remembering anything, but in the scheme of things Iran seems a lot more logical than NK. Perhaps it's because the whole region is a bit more ... complex, but Iran seems more willing to compromise and communicate than NK, especially in recent years. |
Iran is absolutely a more rational actor yes. Not that you'd know it from how people talk.
| BrandonMiaow wrote: | | I saw this story on tumblr and people were genuinely saying he deserved it. a few people mock-celebrating. it kinda made me feel sick. it seems like there's like...North Korea apologists? They were going on about "He visited the country he should have obeyed the laws" What a stunning lack of empathy, tbh. Even if you see him as an entitled white boy it doesn't change the fact that 15 years of hard labor is fucked. |
Yeah there's North Korean apologists. Stupid fucks who'll praise anything if you throw a veneer of communism over it - like uber-tankies.
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
Grzywa
Gender: Male
Location: Polska
|
- #15
- Posted: 05/06/2016 13:29
- Post subject:
|
| Norman Bates wrote: | | I can't, and my take on why not is that socialism can only work if the dictatorship of the proletariat, and the overhaul of the means and tools of production by the workers, is achieved internationally. Countries and borders have no meaning to me. One "communist" country isolated in an ultracapitalist network is doomed. |
Well, the history shows that dictatorship of proletariat first leads to dictatorship of few and, ultimately, to dictatorship, period. So it just doesn't work.
| Norman Bates wrote: | | I can't give you any example of successful, or unbsuccessful, "communist" country, because communism has never been achieved. |
And it will never be. Communism is essentially wrong as it is incompatible both with the human nature (people like possessing things) and the nature of the society (people want the power).
_________________
Always shouts out something obscene
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
|
|
Muslim-Bigfoot
Gender: Male
Age: 33
Location: Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch
|
- #16
- Posted: 05/06/2016 14:32
- Post subject:
|
natural != good
natural != what I claim it to be without being able to show it in the genetic code somehow
natural != unsurmountable
Aristotle's natural = {slavery, ...}
nature of society = {}
_________________
"I feel like for the last two years there’s been sort of a sonic evolution happening and I’ve been experimenting more and more."
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
Allabaster
|
- #17
- Posted: 05/06/2016 15:55
- Post subject:
|
|
The pursuit of one person's ideal will eventually require the forced suppression of another's.
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
undefined
|
- #18
- Posted: 05/06/2016 16:51
- Post subject:
|
| Muslim-Bigfoot wrote: | natural != good
natural != what I claim it to be without being able to show it in the genetic code somehow
natural != unsurmountable
Aristotle's natural = {slavery, ...}
nature of society = {} |
Things that are natural:
Thumbnail. Click to enlarge.
Thumbnail. Click to enlarge.
Thumbnail. Click to enlarge. |
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
Norman Bates
Gender: Male
Age: 51
Location: Paris, France
|
- #19
- Posted: 05/06/2016 17:35
- Post subject:
|
| Grzywa wrote: | | people want the power[/i] |
No. Well, I, for one, don't.
As for possession, I don't agree either.
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
Grzywa
Gender: Male
Location: Polska
|
- #20
- Posted: 05/06/2016 17:51
- Post subject:
|
| Norman Bates wrote: | | No. Well, I, for one, don't. |
But many others do 
| Norman Bates wrote: | | As for possession, I don't agree either. |
I respect that.
_________________
Always shouts out something obscene
|
|
|
|
|
Back to top
|
|
|
|
|
