Greatest Classical Works & Best Recorded Performances

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AfterHours



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  • #111
  • Posted: 09/16/2019 16:55
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RoundTheBend wrote:
AfterHours wrote:

Re: Wish someone would start a "besteverclassical.com" ... Isn't that what we're doing right now? Wink


I suppose so. Also it looks like TalkClassical had some kind of tournament, and this is the list their users came up with: (not quite a database like RYM or BEA, but probably is the closest thing I've seen where a "large" number of users had an aggregate score for the greatest classical works instead of a "single data point".

I disagree with some of it, but I can see how an aggregate could get this type of result.

https://sites.google.com/site/talkclass...anked-list


Good stuff - Classical lists like this rarely feature anything that isn't at least "great", even if the order can sometimes look odd to me, but that comes with territory when so many voters are involved (varying criterias/biases/degrees of experience and familiarity)
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RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad



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  • #112
  • Posted: 09/17/2019 01:32
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AfterHours wrote:

Yeah man -- you're welcome! Staier's Goldberg is practically revolutionary. Once heard, you might wonder where that has been all this time! A completely different world than Gould's (which is great for what it is) ... but the Goldberg's were supposed to be on harpsichord for a reason (they become much more exotic and "dreamier"), and it's very evident they were carefully written for the instrument after listening to a rendition that does them justice. Staier's performance is one of a kind and Baroque asf, down to being played on a precise replica of the harpsichords Bach would've been playing in his day. Maybe the only harpsichordist I can think of that plays the Goldberg (somewhat) similarly with such expressiveness and color could be Christophe Rousset (who's Goldberg's is among my favorites too, maybe #2 or at least top 5). But really, none are so VIVID as Staier's, which is both how he plays but also the fact he is using a harpsichord from the same time.


Here's Pinnock's... I chose it for the same reasons you mentioned here (replica harpsichords/actually a harpsichord recording instead of piano/HIP, etc.)... he's also a trusted HIP recording artist. I wasn't stolen by it though... Staier's work on Bach's harpsichord concertos was quite good (see below), so maybe your find will replace Pinnock's.

https://open.spotify.com/album/5hvzqOez...3IlGmRY6MQ

J.S. Bach: Goldberg Variations; Italian...or Pinnock


J. S. Bach: Harpsichord Concertos by An...korchester
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RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad



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  • #113
  • Posted: 09/17/2019 01:34
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AfterHours wrote:
Not quite a spread sheet but I definitely keep notes of recordings under each work on a separate doc.

Also, I'll sooner or later add a second copy of this list (to the same page) but in alphabetical order by composer. So that way it can be viewed by Classical work rating (how it is currently) but also in alphabetical order (so you'll have all of Beethoven in one spot, all of Bach, all of Mozart etc, making it more accessible in that way).


Yeah, that'd be great.

I really wish there were better ways to manage all this, but this works for now.
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AfterHours



Gender: Male
Location: originally from scaruffi.com ;-)

  • #114
  • Posted: 09/17/2019 02:24
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RoundTheBend wrote:
AfterHours wrote:

Yeah man -- you're welcome! Staier's Goldberg is practically revolutionary. Once heard, you might wonder where that has been all this time! A completely different world than Gould's (which is great for what it is) ... but the Goldberg's were supposed to be on harpsichord for a reason (they become much more exotic and "dreamier"), and it's very evident they were carefully written for the instrument after listening to a rendition that does them justice. Staier's performance is one of a kind and Baroque asf, down to being played on a precise replica of the harpsichords Bach would've been playing in his day. Maybe the only harpsichordist I can think of that plays the Goldberg (somewhat) similarly with such expressiveness and color could be Christophe Rousset (who's Goldberg's is among my favorites too, maybe #2 or at least top 5). But really, none are so VIVID as Staier's, which is both how he plays but also the fact he is using a harpsichord from the same time.


Here's Pinnock's... I chose it for the same reasons you mentioned here (replica harpsichords/actually a harpsichord recording instead of piano/HIP, etc.)... he's also a trusted HIP recording artist. I wasn't stolen by it though... Staier's work on Bach's harpsichord concertos was quite good (see below), so maybe your find will replace Pinnock's.

https://open.spotify.com/album/5hvzqOez...3IlGmRY6MQ

J.S. Bach: Goldberg Variations; Italian...or Pinnock


J. S. Bach: Harpsichord Concertos by An...korchester


Yeah, Pinnock is among my favorite harpsichordists and on last revisit I would probably place him among top 7 or 10 Goldbergs, which is still very high (though not sure if quite enough to include among the top selections). Id for sure place Hentai and Rousset above him (for Goldberg only, not overall) ... and Staier, obviously.

Staier is one of Classical music recordings "best kept secrets" (still, somehow...). You will find several of his on my list (including Harpsichord Conc #1 from the album you pictured in your reply). Only Classical aficianados in the main seem to be much aware of him. Many of his recordings are near top tier or the very top tier ALL TIME. His quality control is among the highest ever, though he shoots for the stars and transcendence every time, thus opening the door to the occasional mis-fire. He is very possibly the greatest harpsichordist and forte pianist of all time.

His Mozart 9, 17, 18, 19 are decisively the greatest renditions of Mozart Piano Concerto recordings ever released (his 27 not so much) and probably the most qualitatively amazing Mozart recordings of any type whether symphony, concerto etc (yes, ever ... 100% serious). For Beethoven, his Ghost Trio is so astonishing (greatest rendition ever recorded) that you may never want to bother with another. I hope to gawd he releases an Archduke at some point! His Diabelli Variations as well -- very top tier! Anyway, you get the idea: just an incredible artist. If you search his name over my list page you'll find him on a number of selections -- all completely deserved -- and I can assure you I am not being "biased" or a "fanboy", I promise! Just listen and compare...
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Last edited by AfterHours on 09/23/2019 02:44; edited 1 time in total
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RoundTheBend
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  • #115
  • Posted: 09/17/2019 02:35
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fanboy Laughing

oooh... I have the Diabelli Variations coming up... I think I have Brendel down for that one, but will very likely check out both. Thanks for the heads up!
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AfterHours



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  • #116
  • Posted: 11/17/2019 18:14
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I am in progress on adding over a thousand (not a typo) additional "best recordings" to the listed Classical works ... hundreds of which have been added so far (for the most part, they've been added from the top of the list on down). Most of these entries are still incomplete in terms of recording information provided (still just "shorthand") and Spotify/Youtube performances, all of which will be added gradually in the coming weeks.

I've been revisiting a lot of Classical Vocal/Mass and Opera works, resulting in extensive updates (several of them still "tentative", marked by asterisks).

In the meantime, I came across this compelling interview with Peter Sellars regarding Bach/St Matthew Passion...

Wish I had this guy's hair! What a character!


Link

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RoundTheBend
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  • #117
  • Posted: 11/17/2019 23:28
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Awesome
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Fischman
RockMonster, JazzMeister, Bluesboy,ClassicalMaster


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  • #118
  • Posted: 11/18/2019 15:09
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This is an incredible thread.

I'm still trying to figure out how to make best use of it!

I probably just need to be able to pay a little more attention. I'm pretty steeped in my Jazz journey right now and that's grabbing most of my time.

The level of detail here is amazing... and at times a bit overwhelming.
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AfterHours



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Location: originally from scaruffi.com ;-)

  • #119
  • Posted: 11/18/2019 16:51
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Fischman wrote:
This is an incredible thread.

I'm still trying to figure out how to make best use of it!

I probably just need to be able to pay a little more attention. I'm pretty steeped in my Jazz journey right now and that's grabbing most of my time.

The level of detail here is amazing... and at times a bit overwhelming.


Thank you! Yours as well!

Looks like we're in the same boat (I'm steeped in Classical, you Jazz for the time being).

Re: best use ... Probably its most value as a resource is that it culminates 20+ yrs of Classical listening (so far, not "final" ... plenty more to listen) ...and collects the best recordings of each work all in one place. Extremely useful for someone not just already into Classical but probably even more so for one trying to get started with Classical as this is often the #1 barrier to really getting going ("Which works to invest in the most?" and "Which recordings/performances?"). Now of course these are the best recordings according to me, however, there is unlikely to be much disagreement from those looking for a performance that is or approaches an expressive ideal of said work while still very aligned to the composers idiom. And even if one disagrees with one, they are bound to agree with one or more of the other selections, as the recordings tend to be a varied collection of many/all of the best renditions from multiple valid interpretations of the work.

For someone more invested/experienced with Classical, the value lies in listening to each of the selected recordings per a given work (or at least a few of them), which can be utterly essential to one's assimilation of that work; a key aspect in getting a really good grip and thorough view of said work, as (a) one is listening to the height of its expression (or nearly) from multiple valid interpretive stances (b) then, hearing the variances between these interpretations and observing and taking into consideration the expressive differences between the very top recording and 2nd, 3rd, etc... really developes one's listening skills for that particular work and goes a long way towards assimilating it well enough to make a very good determination for oneself about the work itself and one's own top recording(s).

Something that can also be of interest or value to whoever, especially to those looking for the "best ever" (as in this or alike sites) is that, in Classical, it is very rare to find anyone that has made a serious attempt at meticulously ranking (and especially, rating) its greatest works per an aligned, uniform criteria. So the Classical canon can be something of a giant, intimidating confusion to people because there isnt a very organized foundation from which to listen from, so something like this can be very useful as a starting and/or intermediate point towards one's own determinations and building one's own selections, ratings, rankings.
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RoundTheBend
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  • #120
  • Posted: 01/21/2020 03:27
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You know I teased my ratings have nothing in common with you, but really there's nothing I can strongly disagree with on this.

Sometimes it's hard to read all in one go (but how else would you do it?) - but really nice to search for something I'm already familiar with to see if there's a recording I haven't heard, etc. I did come across some post-modern stuff I've never heard of, so totally added that to my list.

Thanks for the contribution! Also glad to see the Ring cycle to be added so high. I'm a bit of a fan boy because I took a class on it and nearly crapped myself learning about all the stuff that went into that work.

Oh tip for those who are finding it hard to read - read the top works, then search for the recordings associated.
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