My Criteria For Art - Music Diaries - Forums : Best Ever Albums

Tha1ChiefRocka
Yeah, well hey, I'm really sorry.

Location: Kansas

Hey, I know you're still on a classical kick, so I figured I'd suggest a couple I didn't see on your list.

Ottorino Respighi- The Roman Trilogy (Fontane di Roma, Pini di Roma, Feste Romane)

Anything by Silvestre Revueltas- Particularly 'Sensemaya' or 'La Noche De Los Mayas'.

AfterHours

Gender: Male
Location: originally from scaruffi.com ;-)

Tha1ChiefRocka wrote:

Hey, I know you're still on a classical kick, so I figured I'd suggest a couple I didn't see on your list.

Ottorino Respighi- The Roman Trilogy (Fontane di Roma, Pini di Roma, Feste Romane)

Anything by Silvestre Revueltas- Particularly 'Sensemaya' or 'La Noche De Los Mayas'.

Thank you, I don't believe I've heard those at all. How would you describe them and what would you compare them to? Also, are there any works you're familiar with on my Classical list that you would rank them above?
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Tha1ChiefRocka
Yeah, well hey, I'm really sorry.

Location: Kansas

Respighi's works are on the nationalistic side of things. All about Italian culture and landmarks. I would say his music evokes the places and things they were meant to represent well. It's very visual and atmospheric. I enjoy the fountains of Rome the most since I have visited two of them that the music is supposed to depict. The Trevi Fountain in particular is made easy to visualize even if someone had never seen it.

Here is a good version of "The Pines of Rome" part of the trilogy. They are all tone poems by the way, about 15 to 25 minutes in length.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvgyfqzLC0A

Silvestre Revueltas is one of Mexico's greatest composers. He had a pretty short life though (died at 41) so his output was not as large as other composers. One of his best known works is based off a poem by Nicolas Guillen called Sensemaya which is about the ritualistic killing of a snake. Revueltas is one of those composers that does a good job of incorporating elements of their countries culture with whatever trends in classical was happening at the time. La Noche De Los Mayas was actually a film score, and is similar to his shorter work, Sensemaya.

Here is a good performance of both, this lady is awesome.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh-QIi7nT2s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wwdt8YPp1wY

AfterHours

Gender: Male
Location: originally from scaruffi.com ;-)

Tha1ChiefRocka wrote:

Respighi's works are on the nationalistic side of things. All about Italian culture and landmarks. I would say his music evokes the places and things they were meant to represent well. It's very visual and atmospheric. I enjoy the fountains of Rome the most since I have visited two of them that the music is supposed to depict. The Trevi Fountain in particular is made easy to visualize even if someone had never seen it.

Here is a good version of "The Pines of Rome" part of the trilogy. They are all tone poems by the way, about 15 to 25 minutes in length.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvgyfqzLC0A

Silvestre Revueltas is one of Mexico's greatest composers. He had a pretty short life though (died at 41) so his output was not as large as other composers. One of his best known works is based off a poem by Nicolas Guillen called Sensemaya which is about the ritualistic killing of a snake. Revueltas is one of those composers that does a good job of incorporating elements of their countries culture with whatever trends in classical was happening at the time. La Noche De Los Mayas was actually a film score, and is similar to his shorter work, Sensemaya.

Here is a good performance of both, this lady is awesome.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh-QIi7nT2s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wwdt8YPp1wY

Thank you, I will check them out Smile

Do you feel any of these are superior to any of the works that you're familiar with on my "Greatest Classical" list?
_________________
Best Classical
Best Films
Best Paintings

Tha1ChiefRocka
Yeah, well hey, I'm really sorry.

Location: Kansas

AfterHours wrote:

Tha1ChiefRocka wrote:

Respighi's works are on the nationalistic side of things. All about Italian culture and landmarks. I would say his music evokes the places and things they were meant to represent well. It's very visual and atmospheric. I enjoy the fountains of Rome the most since I have visited two of them that the music is supposed to depict. The Trevi Fountain in particular is made easy to visualize even if someone had never seen it.

Here is a good version of "The Pines of Rome" part of the trilogy. They are all tone poems by the way, about 15 to 25 minutes in length.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvgyfqzLC0A

Silvestre Revueltas is one of Mexico's greatest composers. He had a pretty short life though (died at 41) so his output was not as large as other composers. One of his best known works is based off a poem by Nicolas Guillen called Sensemaya which is about the ritualistic killing of a snake. Revueltas is one of those composers that does a good job of incorporating elements of their countries culture with whatever trends in classical was happening at the time. La Noche De Los Mayas was actually a film score, and is similar to his shorter work, Sensemaya.

Here is a good performance of both, this lady is awesome.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh-QIi7nT2s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wwdt8YPp1wY

Thank you, I will check them out Smile

Do you feel any of these are superior to any of the works that you're familiar with on my "Greatest Classical" list?

I wouldn't say that they are superior to anything, but maybe suitable for the lower tiers of your list.

AfterHours

Gender: Male
Location: originally from scaruffi.com ;-)

Tha1ChiefRocka wrote:

AfterHours wrote:

Tha1ChiefRocka wrote:

Respighi's works are on the nationalistic side of things. All about Italian culture and landmarks. I would say his music evokes the places and things they were meant to represent well. It's very visual and atmospheric. I enjoy the fountains of Rome the most since I have visited two of them that the music is supposed to depict. The Trevi Fountain in particular is made easy to visualize even if someone had never seen it.

Here is a good version of "The Pines of Rome" part of the trilogy. They are all tone poems by the way, about 15 to 25 minutes in length.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvgyfqzLC0A

Silvestre Revueltas is one of Mexico's greatest composers. He had a pretty short life though (died at 41) so his output was not as large as other composers. One of his best known works is based off a poem by Nicolas Guillen called Sensemaya which is about the ritualistic killing of a snake. Revueltas is one of those composers that does a good job of incorporating elements of their countries culture with whatever trends in classical was happening at the time. La Noche De Los Mayas was actually a film score, and is similar to his shorter work, Sensemaya.

Here is a good performance of both, this lady is awesome.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh-QIi7nT2s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wwdt8YPp1wY

Thank you, I will check them out Smile

Do you feel any of these are superior to any of the works that you're familiar with on my "Greatest Classical" list?

I wouldn't say that they are superior to anything, but maybe suitable for the lower tiers of your list.

Okay cool, fair enough, I will check them out and try and give them a rating (even if they rate below 7.8/10)
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AfterHours

Gender: Male
Location: originally from scaruffi.com ;-)

For anyone interested in the logic behind my ratings, I added further insight into this in the "ratings scale" section of My Criteria page -- for the 8.8+, 9.3+ and 9.8+ ratings.
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boyd94

AfterHours wrote:

For anyone interested in the logic behind my ratings, I added further insight into this in the "ratings scale" section of My Criteria page -- for the 8.8+, 9.3+ and 9.8+ ratings.

Quick question about this. I'm an anorak who find all kinds of evaluation and interpretation of art intrinsically interesting so forgive my pedantry, but this confuses me a little:

Quote:

9.0/10 = Combined total of both halves equaling 15.7. Examples: 7.8/10 + 7.9/10; 7.3/10 + 8.4/10

Is this a formula specifically designed to distinguish albums that are more than the sum of their parts? I.e, that an album containing a Side A of 'Historically Extraordinary/Amazing' work and a Side B of 'Near-Masterpiece' work amounts to a work that is cumulatively an 'All-Time Masterpiece' (assuming cohesiveness in emotional/conceptual content from one side to the next)?

AfterHours

Gender: Male
Location: originally from scaruffi.com ;-)

boyd94 wrote:

Quick question about this. I'm an anorak who find all kinds of evaluation and interpretation of art intrinsically interesting so forgive my pedantry, but this confuses me a little:

Quote:

9.0/10 = Combined total of both halves equaling 15.7. Examples: 7.8/10 + 7.9/10; 7.3/10 + 8.4/10

Is this a formula specifically designed to distinguish albums that are more than the sum of their parts? I.e, that an album containing a Side A of 'Historically Extraordinary/Amazing' work and a Side B of 'Near-Masterpiece' work amounts to a work that is cumulatively an 'All-Time Masterpiece' (assuming cohesiveness in emotional/conceptual content from one side to the next)?

Well, yes, but I also dont think there's a legitimate debate otherwise (not that this is your intent). All art is an accumulation of parts/actions (etc), so whether one agrees with my ratings or not, the fundamental idea is difficult to dispute. For an extreme example, consider the following: Michelangelo's Sistine Chapel. Lets say that's a 10/10. If one starts taking figures and scenes away, does it keep the same rating? Is each brush stroke a 10/10? If said stroke were left alone and presented in frame at an art gallery would they each be as great as the Sistine Chapel altogether? Of course not. It is a 10/10 as a whole, and portions of it broken down to such miniscule parts would not nearly be so astonishing and significant (though that doesn't mean I don't think that Michelangelo's tone and brush strokes are possibly, on their own, the most significant of all time, perhaps only surpassed by Da Vinci?). Still, at best, one could look at Michelangelo's tone and conviction in said brush stroke and say something like: "if he keeps painting this way on a scale of The Sistine Chapel he has the potential to produce an astonishing work of art." ... ... Same thing with music. Songs are essentially collections of notes, accumulating into a composition (keeping this simple and concise). Albums are collections of songs. It is very rare, particularly with the best albums, to find cases where a half of the album is better than the whole (because you're generally dealing with a great artist with considerable conviction, inspiration, follow-through and an overall vision). White Light/White Heat and Atlantis, off the top of my head, are the only ones that come to mind. Sister Ray is slightly better alone (maybe) than it fairs with the rest of the album "added" to it, as there is a qualitative dip sufficient enough to (slightly) mitigate the overall emotional/conceptual significance of the work (current ratings might be 6.5 or 6.6 for Side A, 8.9 or 9.0 for Side B). Atlantis (Sun Ra) is a similar issue, but with a greater differential. This phenomenon of substantial quality differential between songs/parts is probably more prevalent with poor or mediocre works, which more often feature great inconsistencies in quality (if they're not just "consistently poor/mediocre" which is very common as well).

Note: The ratings could be broken down in smaller parts (1/3rds, 1/4ths, 1/8ths) and so forth, as well. I chose halves because this was easier to describe ratings-wise, and is also usually my first point of orientation when figuring out an overall rating for an album after listening to it (after that I might break it down further, especially when trying to decide its exact ranking in relation to another work(s) with the same rating ... but "by halves" is almost always my entry point). And especially with Rock/Jazz/Classical music where artists commonly have similarly timed sides to their albums/works, this is simpler to consider and allows one to more easily follow the logic of my ratings (and Scaruffi's too, as it seems to work just as well with his, aside from occasions where we disagree).
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RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad

Location: Ground Control

The Pines of Rome is a staple. Is it the greatest art of all time, no. But neither is 99% of any art.