Revolver vs Parsley, Sage, Rosemary, & Thyme - Music

Lastings

Gender: Male
Age: 42
Location: Minnesota

yeah... Umm..

Tomorrow Never knows almost single-handedly changed the face and direction of popular music.

P,S,R,&T is just a really good folk album.

TheHutts

Gender: Male

The Beatles' best album vs S and G's third best album. Isn't really a contest for me. There are lots of nice tunes, pretentious lyrics, and beautiful arrangements on Parsley, but it's not a contender for my top 100.

Yann

Gender: Male
Location: France

There are about 4 songs I don't like much on Revolver: Taxman (apathetic melody, boring lyrics), Love You Too (not particularly needed, is it), Yellow Submarine, and to a lesser extent I Want to Tell You.
Yet I love the album. What I like about the Beatles (and the Beach Boys, and others) is that they don't have that typical folky beat and vocals that many albums from the sixties have.
I like Simon and Garfunkel but I think they are at their best when they're strictly pop.

RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad

Location: Ground Control

RockyRaccoon wrote:

I mean, I love both albums, don't get me wrong, but I've always had a greater affinity for The Beatles than I have for S&G (though both are close to my heart).

Revolver has grown on me over the years, I never used to think a whole lot of it, I enjoyed it but never quite as much as, say, Sgt. Peppers or Let It Be (preferably Let It Be...Naked) or The White Album. But over time, I've really grown to love it.

There's just so many songs to love on Revolver. I'm Only Sleeping is a killer song, I've used it at gigs before, it's a fun song to play and sing. Here, There, and Everywhere is beautiful, as is For No One. Got To Get You Into My Life is a really fun song (though I have to say, Earth, Wind, & Fire gave the Beatles a run for their money with their cover version). I love Good Day Sunshine too, back in high school it was the ringtone I had for whenever my girlfriend (now wife) called. Tomorrow Never Knows is a cool, trippy song. I've always loved the harmonies on And Your Bird Can Sing.

I dunno, ultimately I just love every track on Revolver, and I've always had a personal preference more towards the Beatles than S&G.

Makes sense. Revolver/Beatles overall have a known record of making solid albums. S&G don't. I suppose for me the highs on PSR&T are much higher or equal to (TNK) than anything on Revolver. But Revolver is still a 95 album for me. So basically comparing apples... hehe. Lots of great material on both.

Also I too prefer Naked over regular Let It Be. As famous as Phil Spector is for his wall of sound, it just didn't work as well for that album.

Also what an endearing ringtone. I think I might be a terrible person because for a year mine was Foxy Lady (mostly the intro cause it sounds so cool) hehehe. (Wayne's World).

RockyRaccoon wrote:

And for what it's worth, Yellow Submarine was intended as a children's song. I've always hated when people knock the Beatles because of the song. I've had plenty of people tell me the Beatles were garbage songwriters because "Look at Yellow Submarine, what a dumb song," which is like saying "Mary Had a Little Lamb" sucks because it lacks lyrical depth about Mary and her lamb.

Well said. It still does drive me batty somehow. I do like the buhba buhba sounds on it somehow... hehe.

For me it's the chorus, really. But like you say, that's what it was meant to be. All fine and good - I'll just continue to skip it 80% of the time.

RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad

Location: Ground Control

Michael1981 wrote:

sethmadsen wrote:

hahahaha...

In my mind these albums are easily comparable given their content and musical prowess.

I feel like Paul Simon's guitar playing smokes any guitar work (not bass) from Dylan, Beatles, Beach Boys... nearly most other guitarists actually - maybe not like Jimmy Page or Jimmi Hendrix as they are playing at a different level, but if they played acoustic - maybe comparable.

Dude, no-one listens to Dylan for his great guitar work Laughing

For sure - I just added him to the list. While Dylan is indeed a better lyricist, I think Paul isn't too far (poor man's dylan). For me, Paul is easily a top 5 songwriter of the 60s.

sethmadsen wrote:

Anyone read the OP and have anything to comment on the synergy of the albums or what have you?

Also someone brought up Bob Dylan. His release in 66 was Blonde on Blonde. So I guess I lose with that argument Laughing

(all I'm saying is that is a much more renowned album than anything by S&G).

What am I missing?

Actually, I think you make an interesting comparison between these albums. I'm only just getting to know PSRT but having listened again I can see how it could be regarded on a similar level to Revolver in terms of composition and musicianship. In some ways, it sounds a bit more grown-up and refined.

For me though Revolver has to win though by a clear margin as it's so much more original, imaginative and charming. Arguably, It's very of it's time may even a little naive seeming today, but it's just such a bold, playful and incessantly vibrant and joyous album.

What interests me in this comparison is the contrast in tone. Revolver is so childlike and seems to fully embrace hippy counter-cultural ideals. PSRT on the other hand seems much more aloof and seems to make fun of Hippies and people's obsession with Dylan. For me, PSRT is probably more astute but Revolver is much more charming.[/quote]

Thanks for the response to the OP, and I think I agree with nearly everything you said (minus it winning by a clear margin Very Happy

)

I mean like I said earlier though, it is a bit like comparing apples to apples (one might be more crisp, yet the other more tasty).

And yes, I find A Simple Desultory Philippic pretty funny on more accounts than the Dylan/Stones/Beatles "slam". I think it was all in jest and not really a slight against anyone. My favorite lyric is probably: "And I learned the truth from Lenny Bruce"

For those who want to read the lyrics:
I been Norman Mailered, Maxwell Taylored
I been John O'Hara'd, McNamara'd
I been Rolling Stoned and Beatled till I'm blind
I been Ayn Randed, nearly branded
Communist, 'cause I'm left-handed
That's the hand I use, well, never mind

I been Phil Spectored, resurrected
I been Lou Adlered, Barry Sadlered
Well, I paid all the dues I want to pay
And I learned the truth from Lenny Bruce
And all my wealth won't buy me health
So I smoke a pint of tea a day

I knew a man, his brain was so small
He couldn't think of nothing at all
Not the same as you and me
He doesn't dig poetry
He's so unhip that when you say Dylan
He thinks you're talking about Dylan Thomas
Whoever he was
The man ain't got no culture
But it's alright, ma, everybody must get stoned

I been Mick Jaggered and silver daggered
Andy Warhol, won't you please come home?
I been mother, father, aunt and uncled
Been Roy Haleed and Art Garfunkeled
I just discovered somebody's tapped my phone

Folk rock
I've lost my harmonica, Albert

RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad

Location: Ground Control

Lastings wrote:

yeah... Umm..

Tomorrow Never knows almost single-handedly changed the face and direction of popular music.

P,S,R,&T is just a really good folk album.

TNK is amazing and was a force to recon with, but I'm a fan of New Historicism, which more or less means nothing really single handedly did anything. At the same time, I agree with you... it really did open some doors.

Also PSR&T is much more than a good folk album. A good folk album is Pink Moon or something. PSR&T musically is quite a bit more advanced than a good folk album.

But I also see I'm likely the minority who agrees with the brilliance on PSR&T. The lyricism, music, emotions, cleverness, etc. of it is criminally underrated, imo.

RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad

Location: Ground Control

TheHutts wrote:

The Beatles' best album vs S and G's third best album. Isn't really a contest for me. There are lots of nice tunes, pretentious lyrics, and beautiful arrangements on Parsley, but it's not a contender for my top 100.

I've always found the argument of pretentious interesting. It's like who gets to decide that the culture/importance is greater than possessed? Isn't it quite possible that someone could see any works of art could be considered pretentious?

Thing is I've made that same argument... just stating it's interesting on how it becomes understood as such.

What brings you to the conclusion it is pretentious?

I'm just playing devil's advocate here, I don't actually think this, but I suppose you could say TNK is pretentious. It borrows ideas from Timothy Leary and Stockhausen... they are just so pretentious to pull such great ideas into their music. I mean - I'd call bullshit on that argument, but that's technically the definition of pretentious, innit?

But you might be right that it's not their best album. For me it's a bit like choosing the best album for The Beatles post Rubber Soul. Right now PSR&T is their best album for me, but I do really like the others.

RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad

Location: Ground Control

Yann wrote:

I like Simon and Garfunkel but I think they are at their best when they're strictly pop.

When might this be?

Also Taxman is one of my favorite Beatles songs... hehehe. To each their own. I guess I can see where you are coming from with the lyrics - they are simple, but they also are pretty cutting. I also love the bass and guitar work in it.

Yann

Gender: Male
Location: France

sethmadsen wrote:

Yann wrote:

I like Simon and Garfunkel but I think they are at their best when they're strictly pop.

When might this be?

Also Taxman is one of my favorite Beatles songs... hehehe. To each their own. I guess I can see where you are coming from with the lyrics - they are simple, but they also are pretty cutting. I also love the bass and guitar work in it.

Cool when Sethmadsen collect the “papers” Drool

About Taxman, you’re right about the rhythm section, and yes the song is quite engaging for that reason, but I’m not one of those Taxman/Rain/Paperback Writers admirers: really not their best melodies/tunes. And I don’t find very entertaining a song about tax collection. (besides tax is good for investment, growth and reducting the ever growing inegality between the rich and the poor Smile

).

About folk music, to me pop has mostly outdated it. These pop pionners have created a music that directly influenced today’s pop/rock music (regardless of R&B massive resurgence)
Whereas Jefferson Airplane’s folk is very dated to me (especially the singing) and I doubt there will be a Jefferson Airplane revival someday, even if their songs were good.
(deep choked 80’s voices will (or have) probably followed the same fate, except Spandau Ballet’s True, which is immortal)

to answer your question, The song Bridge over Troubled Water for example, I don't know if it's pop, but it doesn't have at all that sort of dated 60's folk singing.

theblueboy

Yann wrote:

sethmadsen wrote:

Yann wrote:

I like Simon and Garfunkel but I think they are at their best when they're strictly pop.

When might this be?

Also Taxman is one of my favorite Beatles songs... hehehe. To each their own. I guess I can see where you are coming from with the lyrics - they are simple, but they also are pretty cutting. I also love the bass and guitar work in it.

Cool when Sethmadsen collect the “papers” Drool

About Taxman, you’re right about the rhythm section, and yes the song is quite engaging for that reason, but I’m not one of those Taxman/Rain/Paperback Writers admirers: really not their best melodies/tunes. And I don’t find very entertaining a song about tax collection. (besides tax is good for investment, growth and reducting the ever growing inegality between the rich and the poor Smile

).

About folk music, to me pop has mostly outdated it. These pop pionners have created a music that directly influenced today’s pop/rock music (regardless of R&B massive resurgence)
Whereas Jefferson Airplane’s folk is very dated to me (especially the singing) and I doubt there will be a Jefferson Airplane revival someday, even if their songs were good.
(deep choked 80’s voices will (or have) probably followed the same fate, except Spandau Ballet’s True, which is immortal)

to answer your question, The song Bridge over Troubled Water for example, I don't know if it's pop, but it doesn't have at all that sort of dated 60's folk singing.

Yeah, Seth is awesome on the feedback/ discussion Very Happy

I kinda like some 60s folk, though I don't know the scene well.

My problem is more that I feel like Simon and Garfunkel didnt quite know what direction they wanted to go in at the time of PSR&T. It seems to veer between folk, pop, a bit of a nod to jazz. Then pastiches of folk-rock and psych-rock as well. They seem cautious about 60s counter-culture but I don't think they say to much meaningful about it on this album really, compared to the Beatles or Dylan for example. Except for the powerful anti-Vietnam war feeling on two tracks that is. That doesn't make it a bad album of course, it just doesn't seem that culturally significant to me.