How to approach Marx's ideas

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BARDAMU





  • #11
  • Posted: 09/09/2020 00:43
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RoundTheBend wrote:
Orwell was a democratic socialist and the work is considered one of the great Marxist readings of ... the century


lmfao nuff said right here
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RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad



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  • #12
  • Posted: 09/09/2020 04:29
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BARDAMU wrote:
lmfao nuff said right here


May you educate yourself:
Quote:
Marxist criticism is not merely a 'sociology of literature', concerned with how novels get published and whether they mention the working class. Its aim is to explain the literary work more fully; and this means a sensitive attention to its forms, styles and, meanings. But it also means grasping those forms, styles and meanings as the product of a particular history.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marxist_l..._criticism

Quote:
Eric Arthur Blair (25 June 1903 – 21 January 1950),[1] known by his pen name George Orwell, was an English novelist, essayist, journalist and critic.[2] His work is characterised by lucid prose, biting social criticism, opposition to totalitarianism, and outspoken support of democratic socialism


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Orwell

Or you could stick to fifth grade facts you listed off, which by bloom's taxonomy is the most basic understanding of anything:



If you don't like my analysis, why don't you come up with something more intelligent with a counterpoint than
Quote:
LMFAO
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BARDAMU





  • #13
  • Posted: 09/09/2020 21:28
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RoundTheBend wrote:
May you educate yourself


Yes. I'm aware that Orwell was a "democratic socialist." Democratic socialism =/= Marxism. Orwell was not a Marxist.

But if you like Wikipedia articles, here's one for you:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orwell%27s_list
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mickilennial
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  • #14
  • Posted: 09/10/2020 01:41
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Link


Covers a bit of Animal Farm at the end in relation to the content, of which I agree.

19:16
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RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad



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  • #15
  • Posted: 09/10/2020 03:07
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BARDAMU wrote:
Yes. I'm aware that Orwell was a "democratic socialist." Democratic socialism =/= Marxism. Orwell was not a Marxist.

But if you like Wikipedia articles, here's one for you:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orwell%27s_list


I actually didn't say he was a Marxist. I said it was a good Marxist read as in Marxist literary criticism. Is not most of the book about class struggle?

I suppose if you understand literary criticism that would have been not misunderstood. You probably thought I meant that it was literally communist literature.
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RoundTheBend
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  • #16
  • Posted: 09/10/2020 03:12
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Gowi wrote:

Link


Covers a bit of Animal Farm at the end in relation to the content, of which I agree.

19:16


Interesting. Would've never put Neo-Con and Trotsky in the same boat... curious how he makes that connection. Not saying he's wrong, just want to know more.
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LedZep




Croatia (Hrvatska)

  • #17
  • Posted: 09/10/2020 10:58
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Maybe a bit off topic, but why do communism and Marx’s theories in general have such a bad reputation in the US? Is it the Cold War, bad education on the topic or something else?
_________________
Finally updated the overall chart

2020s
90s
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mickilennial
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  • #18
  • Posted: 09/10/2020 16:47
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LedZep wrote:
Maybe a bit off topic, but why do communism and Marx’s theories in general have such a bad reputation in the US? Is it the Cold War, bad education on the topic or something else?

That's a long and complicated answer. Mostly due to institutionalized fear that lingers through ignorance via the Red Scare. It's rather ahistorical to be afraid of it due to FDR's socialist adjacent policies, but Americans have a short memory at times. This answer doesn't even explain it well.
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RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad



Location: Ground Control
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  • #19
  • Posted: 09/11/2020 00:54
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LedZep wrote:
Maybe a bit off topic, but why do communism and Marx’s theories in general have such a bad reputation in the US? Is it the Cold War, bad education on the topic or something else?


To be honest it's cold war propaganda. And Marx is merely a paragraph you read in any education pre-college. And as Gowi alluded to, the US had a "socialist" past that got squashed out via various things.

I think honestly the Truman story is the biggest change in trajectory for American history. Wallace served as FDR's vice president until 1944 when he was not re-elected/nomincated as such. Truman won against possibly one of the most left leaning politicians in American history, Wallace. One major reason he lost the election was over how to deal with Russia and that Truman was a bit more "good old boy" and less progressive.

Wallace was fighting for in the 40s desegregation of schools and gender equality... things our country didn't really do until much... much later, and arguably still have "good old boys" fighting against it.

You can even link it to puritan roots, etc.

Lot's of factors... but likely banana pudding is the greatest cause. And iPhones.

Some American's used to say stuff like, drop a Sears catalog behind the iron curtain and watch it fall.

Another way to say that is Americans are on average incredibly materialistic and behind on education in a lot of ways, which allows for crony capitalism to pacify us.

We are no longer have the guts we used to. Complacent. Corrupt. I mean for hells sake, we are nervous the worst president in the history of the US is potentially not only going to get re-elected but somehow become a dictator (if you don't believe me, listen to more NPR and professors of political science talk about it all the time on there). At least Nixon had the balls to resign and America kinda had the balls to create that environment.

Now we let Russia run our country.
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mickilennial
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  • #20
  • Posted: 09/11/2020 07:39
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Now we let Russia run our country.

lol russiagating is a convenient neoliberal device to keep people from paying attention to the other factors that led to Trump get into power and their own party corruption. Russia's influence in our elections last sequence is often grossly exaggerated (though yes there was an attempt) to utilize the same fearmongering the GOP uses routinely.
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