Oh yeah, using the "Russia" excuse to distract people from actual problems and gain voters is similar to "Serbia" excuse over here. Thanks for clarification both of you! _________________ Finally updated the overall chart
lol russiagating is a convenient neoliberal device to keep people from paying attention to the other factors that led to Trump get into power and their own party corruption. Russia's influence in our elections last sequence is often grossly exaggerated (though yes there was an attempt) to utilize the same fearmongering the GOP uses routinely.
hyperbole I guess was too much there.
And I'm surprised you feel like it's only a neoliberal device/fearmongering from the GOP. I feel like both sides use it? Usually neoliberal means people who are basically anti-bernie (more from an economic point of view - less government regulation, etc.), which can be on the democratic side as well, so just curious what you actually meant here.
Last edited by RoundTheBend on 09/13/2020 02:34; edited 1 time in total
I just realized everyone was focused on getting triggered instead of having a conversation and only focused on my hyperbolic statement or getting a fact wrong that had no real impact on the overall conversation. It seems like focusing on the triggers seems to be the only part of this conversation that matters. Peace out.
Thumbnail. Click to enlarge.
Last edited by RoundTheBend on 09/13/2020 00:05; edited 1 time in total
Russiagate is probably less serious than most liberals think it is, but more serious than most leftists think it is. A common response is minimizing it while pointing out that the US has meddled in elections frequently. Yes, the US has frequently meddled in elections on the side of oppressive right-wing leaders, which is awful. But that doesn't make it okay that another nation is meddling in our elections on the side of oppressive right-wing leaders. Both are wrong and bad. Those who are hypocritical about election meddling deserve to be criticized, but Russian interference does not deserve to be legitimized or minimized. _________________ Add me on RYM
Russiagate is probably less serious than most liberals think it is, but more serious than most leftists think it is. A common response is minimizing it while pointing out that the US has meddled in elections frequently. Yes, the US has frequently meddled in elections on the side of oppressive right-wing leaders, which is awful. But that doesn't make it okay that another nation is meddling in our elections on the side of oppressive right-wing leaders. Both are wrong and bad. Those who are hypocritical about election meddling deserve to be criticized, but Russian interference does not deserve to be legitimized or minimized.
Russiagate is probably less serious than most liberals think it is, but more serious than most leftists think it is. A common response is minimizing it while pointing out that the US has meddled in elections frequently. Yes, the US has frequently meddled in elections on the side of oppressive right-wing leaders, which is awful. But that doesn't make it okay that another nation is meddling in our elections on the side of oppressive right-wing leaders. Both are wrong and bad. Those who are hypocritical about election meddling deserve to be criticized, but Russian interference does not deserve to be legitimized or minimized.
I agree for the most part. I'm just stating a fact that neoliberals lean on it in a way conservatives leaned on the red scare with McCarthyism throughout the Cold War. You would have to be a fool to disregard the intelligence and facts that Russia did and will continue to try to influence western politics for their own benefit.
Russiagate is probably less serious than most liberals think it is, but more serious than most leftists think it is. A common response is minimizing it while pointing out that the US has meddled in elections frequently. Yes, the US has frequently meddled in elections on the side of oppressive right-wing leaders, which is awful. But that doesn't make it okay that another nation is meddling in our elections on the side of oppressive right-wing leaders. Both are wrong and bad. Those who are hypocritical about election meddling deserve to be criticized, but Russian interference does not deserve to be legitimized or minimized.
Obviously Russia "interfered" in the 2016 election, but certainly not to the degree that America interfered in the 1996 Russian election. What about AIPAC? Where's the moaning on CNN about Israelgate? It's certainly been going on for a lot longer than any "Russiagate" and it's been far more effective.
My understanding was that the Russian "troll farms" were largely trying to take advantage of already-extant fissures in American society by signal-boosting populist candidates on both sides (Trump AND Sanders), as well as Black Lives Matter and reactionary gun groups. Knowing that Russia "wanted" a divisive Bernie campaign didn't stop me from going south of the boarder to work on the Bernie campaign myself (Canadian interference, if you will -- call it "Canadagate").
The degree to which Russiagate is manipulated by liberals is frankly worse than Russiagate itself, and has a far more odious effect on democracy. Every last bad thing the Democrats have ever done is considered "Russian propaganda," and they reinforce as much nightly on every news network. A woman coming forward to accuse Biden of sexual assault has been dubbed "Russian interference," ffs. As far as I'm concerned, it's more constructive to throw out the whole concern than entertain it for a second and let these ghouls run with it.
RoundTheBend wrote:
Also for clarify sake, the term neoliberal to me has more to do with the deregulation of government, so I was a bit confused of it's use here.
I think Gowi just meant that the excuse was largely used by supporters of neoliberalism (various MSM outlets and establishment Dems) to explain the rise of populism, not that it necessarily has to intrinsically do with neoliberalism as an ideology itself.
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
