Confirmed on discogs and allmusic and pretty much by the title of the album
Discogs shows a release date of 1963. Allmusic and RYM do show 1964. The album title could be deceiving, but there are 2 of the 3 sites that agree with 1964. _________________ I'm leaning on the threshold
Of her mystery
And crashing through the walls
Of dying history
It CAN'T be the fallback because which year chart you put an album onto is not a choice. You HAVE to add it to the year that is currently selected as year of release. BEA does not allow you to do otherwise.
Ehh, I think we're arguing at cross-purposes here. What I'm referring to has nothing to do with having (or not having) the ability to choose what year's chart the album goes into, what I'm talking about is the administrative decision on whether or not to change the year long after lots of people have charted it for whatever the original year value was. This only becomes an issue after that value has been changed by someone and now has to be approved or rejected. So, IOW, if you don't know and nobody agrees what the year should be, just "fall back" to that original year value.
And as much as I like and respect Discogs, it's pretty clear they go by what's printed on the label (if not the album cover), and for good or ill, that's not always accurate.
Ehh, I think we're arguing at cross-purposes here. What I'm referring to has nothing to do with having (or not having) the ability to choose what year's chart the album goes into, what I'm talking about is the administrative decision on whether or not to change the year long after lots of people have charted it for whatever the original year value was. This only becomes an issue after that value has been changed by someone and now has to be approved or rejected. So, IOW, if you don't know and nobody agrees what the year should be, just "fall back" to that original year value.
And as much as I like and respect Discogs, it's pretty clear they go by what's printed on the label (if not the album cover), and for good or ill, that's not always accurate.
Yes, it might be disruptive if albums keep swinging back and forth (but this has been the current situation for many years). The important thing, certainly from my perspective, is that the data on the site is trusted. I think knowingly keeping incorrect data on the site isn't something I'm comfortable with. In the case of some of these albums, where the year has swung back and forth (and it's impossible to choose the 'right' year), the new guidelines should help to reduce data volatility (after a period of bedding in). At the moment, somebody can come along & make a change on a whim, which is not good for anyone and it's causing endless debate on each admin page if people's changes aren't accepted. Objective rules will make the site operate more smoothly for everybody.
If you review some of Discogs' changes, the conversations are fairly similar to RYM and other places. Discogs perhaps fall back on the copyright year if there's no other information to support an alternate release year, like other sites as well (as often the only information that survives is what's printed on the label).
No single source is infallible. The fact that three sources are being used on BEA should help to counteract if one of the sources is wrong. A point earlier in this conversation about RYM having a thread of incorrect album years represents a tiny fraction of the albums on their site (and some of the proposed edits in that thread might not end up being approved). Discogs 'Master' and RYM's 'Primary' releases keeps this fairly simple and will lead to consistent results and help maintain a low error percentage.
Last edited by albummaster on 04/08/2025 15:31; edited 1 time in total
"Seems to be" = creating argument and discrepancy for the sake of doing so. This is a release date that is agreed on by 2 of the 3 sites.
RYM shows January 1986 as the release date (it shows 1985 as the recording date, which doesn't count), which means it is agreed on by 2 sites of the 3. Although if we include Musicbrainz which shows 1985 as the earliest date of the first releases, we have a tie.
Please. Again. Read the current guidelines. I don't know how else to say it to you. RYM shows two releases from 1985. And we are not including Musicbrainz in doing this, PER THE CURRENT GUIDELINES. This should be a simple one and done with this album. Yet here we are still hashing it out. _________________ I'm leaning on the threshold
Of her mystery
And crashing through the walls
Of dying history
Jan 1st 2019 according to Discogs.
Either Nov 9th 2018 or Jan 1st 2019 according to RYM. In the modding history they discuss the November 2018 digital file is a streamed audio on KEXP's website, although I think there is no clear information if the file could be a downloadable digital file available to everyone according to BEA rules, so we might stick with the info concening the 2019 CD physical release.
Allmusic doesn't have it in their database.
If the KEXP streaming show was an actual album release, it doesn't matter now because the station has taken it down. This makes the 2018 date irrelevant except as the recording date. Released as an album for purchase in 2019. _________________ I'm leaning on the threshold
Of her mystery
And crashing through the walls
Of dying history
Confirmed on discogs and allmusic and pretty much by the title of the album
Discogs shows a release date of 1963. Allmusic and RYM do show 1964. The album title could be deceiving, but there are 2 of the 3 sites that agree with 1964.
Who thought that release date would cause such a minefield / in-depth conversation. Mega Important though as far as charts are concerned so definitely need to get it as right as we can.
Who thought that release date would cause such a minefield / in-depth conversation.
It gets to be more of a problem for people with huge MP3 libraries because they have to decide if they're going to alter their ID3 tags, which can alter your "smart playlists" and "scrobbling statistics" if or when they're based on dates. I mean, sure, it's definitely a "First World problem," but if the alternative is to pay attention to what's going in the real world, you can sort of see the logic behind it.
Fine implementation, just a question though : when are Songs of Leonard Cohen and Liberation Music Orchestra going to stop changing years? I've been changing them charts all of my BEA life, and that traces back some. I'm pretty sure I just changed SoLC the other day and I have to change it again.
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