In addition to Norm's excellent examples, anything from Black Monk Time (released a few months prior to Revolver) makes Taxman look like a feckin' nursery rhyme. A fuzz guitar doesn't make something 'punk', sunshine:
the best examples you and norman bates have given are strychnine (for the outro mostly) and the monks, but honestly none of it would seem out of place in a 50's, early 60's classic rock playlist. except that chuck berry and little richard are just better. what makes taxman punk is the absolutely obnoxious guitar solo combined with lyrics like "yeah I'm the taxman/ and you're working for no one but me." ofc lyrics about drinking strychnine are obv the ramones b4 ramones, but that isn't the attitude that inspired the best, not nearly as dangerous. it's silly and juvenile - in a way mocking what the greats have done b4 them and in this way is certainly punkish, but by no means in the same vein as taxman.
it's the sort that would rile up christians, but not worry government. when I think great punk, it's the combination of riot-inspiring, anarchistic influence in the lyrics and composition that makes uppity, "sophisticated," rich, white Englishmen grimace, scoff, and cover their ears. taxman got it done and nothing b4 it was even necessary for the sex pistols.
This might just be the worst thread in the history of BEA. _________________ I'm leaning on the threshold
Of her mystery
And crashing through the walls
Of dying history
when I think great punk, it's the combination of riot-inspiring, anarchistic influence in the lyrics and composition that makes uppity, "sophisticated," rich, white Englishmen grimace, scoff, and cover their ears. taxman got it done and nothing b4 it was even necessary for the sex pistols.
fuck man if that's all it takes for something to be punk...
I don't find everything the Beatles did to be overrated like some, but Rubber Soul is way too high on this site in my opinion. I would definitely put it in the top 50 or so but 21 makes it way overrated. Rolling Stone put it in their top 5 if I'm not mistaken. Same thing with the White Album at 11. It's great and very unique but 11 is way too high.
Personally I'm not really a fan of the Neutral Milk Hotel record either.
Rubber Soul may be a little too high, and the White Album is definitely waay to high.
Where would you rate the White Album? It's kind of an anomaly for me. Never sure on where is the right spot for it.
No idea, it has some of the highest highs yet there is simply too much filler. Lets compare it to other great double albums. It's definitely weaker than Blonde on Blonde and The Wall. However. it's better than Exile (which is also overrated).
Definitely weaker than Blonde On Blonde. It's kind of like a Genesis Lamb. I probably go to the Lamb more often than the White Album, and disc 1 of the Lamb is pretty much flawless, side two for me doesn't hold up as well. You are right about the White Album having the highest highs and then not so much. But it's spread out much differently than the Lamb. _________________ Attention all planets of the solar federation: We have assumed control.
what was more punk than Taxman b4 taxman? what was more experimental than tomorrow never knows b4 revolver? who incorporated indian influences into rock or pop b4 Love You To? what rock group had a piano ballad as powerful as Eleanor Rigby in '66? what was as hedonistic and blasphemous back then? "there's ppl standing 'round/ who'll screw you in the ground/ they'll fill you in with all the sins you see." are you kidding me? what was psychedelic b4 I'm Only Sleeping? the vocal track sample/cinematic quality of yellow submarine... were there even albums so clearly influenced by and dedicated to drugs back then? revolver did it all. every innovation in one album, amid some of the best love songs and ballads ever written. the birth of modern rock. a record as an actual work of art beyond simple poetry wasn't even done b4 this. music was motown, jazz, blues, and standard 50's style rock n roll. this opened the door and paved the way to everything. you're joking. "revolver overrated," no way. I believe at #3 it's UNDERrated. best of all time, hands down. in another thread you say the best 3 album run is Tim Buckley, you really think he could have ever done Starsailor w/o revolver?
--what was more punk than Taxman b4 taxman?
The Velvet Underground and Nico was being recorded in 1966, prior to and around the same time as Revolver. Along with its follow-up (White Light/White Heat), it is the main, most direct, inspiration for punk music (along with the attitudes of The Rolling Stones), prior to artists such as the MC5, The Stooges and so forth. Taxman was not punk. But even prior to that, many many many free and avant-garde jazz works prior to 1966 were way more ferocious and “punk” than Taxman (which isn’t punk anyway). Artists such as Ornette Coleman, John Coltrane, Cecil Taylor, Sun Ra, Albert Ayler, Charles Mingus, Eric Dolphy, Sam Rivers, Max Roach, Marion Brown, Archie Shepp, etc., all released albums and songs/suites/tracks that are WAYYYY more raw and vigorous and anarchic than Taxman (and anything else rock was doing at the time).
--what was more experimental than tomorrow never knows b4 revolver?
All of the above jazz artists (and several more) composed works that were far more experimental than Tomorrow Never Knows – though Tomorrow Never Knows is a great song, one of The Beatles best and easily the best on the album.
The Velvet Underground (especially Heroin, European Son, Venus in Furs) all of which were recorded in Spring of ’66 (if I’m not mistaken) and being played at shows. Frank Zappa with Freak Out, The Fugs (particularly Virgin Forest), arguably some of Bob Dylan’s works of the period, at least in form and ambition (especially Sad Eyed Lady of the Lowlands), arguably Sandy Bull (Fantasia’s for Guitar and Banjo)
--who incorporated indian influences into rock or pop b4 Love You To?
The most prominent example (and more importantly) better use of Indian influences, would probably be Eight Miles High by The Byrds. Others such as Yardbirds and The Beatles own Norwegian Wood incorporated vague elements… Within You Without You is easily The Beatles best example imo…
--what rock group had a piano ballad as powerful as Eleanor Rigby in '66?
Ballad of a Thin Man by Dylan is much more powerful imo, as but one example.
--what was as hedonistic and blasphemous back then? "there's ppl standing 'round/ who'll screw you in the ground/ they'll fill you in with all the sins you see." are you kidding me?
Bob Dylan, Frank Zappa, The Velvet Underground, Fugs, Free Jazz, etc.
--what was psychedelic b4 I'm Only Sleeping?
Bob Dylan (starting with Mr Tambourine Man), Frank Zappa, The Velvet Undeground, Free Jazz (especially Sun Ra)
--the vocal track sample/cinematic quality of yellow submarine...
Fugs, Frank Zappa…
--were there even albums so clearly influenced by and dedicated to drugs back then?
I don’t know why this is even remotely important, but Zappa, Dylan, Fugs, etc…
--revolver did it all. every innovation in one album, amid some of the best love songs and ballads ever
written. the birth of modern rock. a record as an actual work of art beyond simple poetry wasn't even done b4 this. music was motown, jazz, blues, and standard 50's style rock n roll. this opened the door and paved the way to everything. you're joking. "revolver overrated," no way. I believe at #3 it's UNDERrated. best of all time, hands down. in another thread you say the best 3 album run is Tim Buckley, you really think he could have ever done Starsailor w/o revolver?
The Velvet Underground is very clearly the main stepping stone/birth to modern rock, with Dylan and Neil Young, Rolling Stones, and at it’s foundation, Chuck Berry, along with that. Buckley was influenced by the likes of Miles Davis and avant-garde jazz, Van Morrison, Bob Dylan, and perhaps Fred Neil – certainly not The Beatles’ Revolver.
RoundTheBendI miss the comfort in being sadProfile Ground Control
Of the "feted" albums "Never Mind the Bullocks...." would be my choice. Other than god save the queen, holidays in the sun and anarchy in the u.k I think it's pretty meh.
I wonder if people were hoodwinked by the publicity and b.s that surrounds i? .
Of the "feted" albums "Never Mind the Bullocks...." would be my choice. Other than god save the queen, holidays in the sun and anarchy in the u.k I think it's pretty meh.
I wonder if people were hoodwinked by the publicity and b.s that surrounds i? .
"Bodies" and "Pretty Vacant" are also pretty good. Hey, wait, does that mean that's actually a solid rock album?
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