Revelations:
- he thinks he might have overrated Trout Mask due to its initial shock value and the desire to remain oppositional
- (restricted to production/sound quality at least) he "enjoys" Sgt. Pepper
- he was peer-pressured into keeping Type O Negative at a 9/10 for a while (no longer the case...)
Revelations:
- he thinks he might have overrated Trout Mask due to its initial shock value and the desire to remain oppositional
- (restricted to production/sound quality at least) he "enjoys" Sgt. Pepper
- he was peer-pressured into keeping Type O Negative at a 9/10 for a while (no longer the case...)
Thanks!
It’s a curious position he may be posing on TMR that I’ve kinda-sorta shared for moments here and there in recent years. Sometimes, especially after emerging from more classically formed masterpieces (like classic architecture, classical music masterpieces from the Baroque through Romantic periods…) I get so used to a masterpiece being more “goal oriented” or “purpose-ful” and clearly or finely organized into a wholly aligned work, then it takes me a little bit to re-acclimate to TMRs near refusal to be as such and allow it to re-wire how a masterpiece should be. Occasionally I’ve wondered if this added effort should count against it? But then… While at the same time it is yet also a sign of just how staggering and original and creative it remains to this day… Sometimes I think it’s a 9 and not 9.3+ but the feeling isn’t strong enough or consistent enough to drop it, and it usually makes up for it a listen or two later anyway…
It’s a curious position he may be posing on TMR that I’ve kinda-sorta shared for moments here and there in recent years. Sometimes, especially after emerging from more classically formed masterpieces (like classic architecture, classical music masterpieces from the Baroque through Romantic periods…) I get so used to a masterpiece being more “goal oriented” or “purpose-ful” and clearly or finely organized into a wholly aligned work, then it takes me a little bit to re-acclimate to TMRs near refusal to be as such and allow it to re-wire how a masterpiece should be. Occasionally I’ve wondered if this added effort should count against it? But then… While at the same time it is yet also a sign of just how staggering and original and creative it remains to this day… Sometimes I think it’s a 9 and not 9.3+ but the feeling isn’t strong enough or consistent enough to drop it, and it usually makes up for it a listen or two later anyway…
Scaruffi, the ever expanding enigma… ❓💡 :?:
I read the Type O Negative part of the interview too quickly, but anyway, yeah I see what you mean. So long as TMR's refusal to play by the old rules can be seen as an expansion of those rules, then it's rating should stand. But if the rules are sacred then it falls short a few ticks.
Working on this now (still movies too…). Recommendations, discussion welcome
I also have made the overall “Greatest” list more user friendly by adding a space between each listed entry so (with their oftentimes extended titles/artists) they can now be easily differentiated from along the whole list. List is here: https://www.besteveralbums.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15560
Guernica - Pablo Picasso (1937) / Museo Reina Sofía, Madrid, Spain [Painting]8.6/10 to 8.5/10
The Last Supper - Leonardo da Vinci (circa 1495 - 1498) / Santa Maria delle Grazie, Milan, Italy [Painting]8.6/10 to 8.5/10
Sainte-Chapelle - Jean de Chelles or Thomas de Cormont (1242 - 1248) / Paris, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]8.4/10 to 8.3/10
The Conversion of Saul and The Crucifixion of St. Peter - Michelangelo Buonarroti (circa 1542 - 1545; circa 1546 - 1550) / Pauline Chapel, Vatican City, Rome, Italy [Painting]8.4/10 to 8.3/10
Notre-Dame de Paris - Main construction principally directed under Bishop Maurice de Sully (1163 - 1260, main construction; various additions, updates, restorations thereafter; reconstruction of fleche and roof from fire damages: 2019 - 2024) / Parvis Notre-Dame – Place Jean-Paul-II, Paris, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]8.1/10 to 7.9/10
Monreale Cathedral - Begun by William II of Sicily in 1174; various modifications thereafter (1267) / Monreale, Sicily, Italy [Architecture, including Mosaics and Structural Sculpture]8.4/10 to 8.2/10; 8.2/10 to 7.9/10
Batalha Monastery - Afonso Domingues (1388 - 1402); Huguet (1402 - 1438 in which several Flamboyant Gothic elements were added; changed architects posthumously, continued construction, revisions, additions through completion circa 1517) / Batalha, Portugal [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]8.0/10 to 7.7/10
Strasbourg CathedralNot Rated to 7.7/10
Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception (Washington DC)Not Rated to 7.6/10
Houses of Parliament (London)Not Rated to 7.5/10; 7.5/10 to 7.6/10
Sacré-Cœur BasilicaNot Rated to 7.6/10
St Paul’s Cathedral (London)Not Rated to 7.6/10
Sainte-Cécile CathedralNot Rated to 7.6/10 Note: 7.6 or above is a bit dependent on how much of the elaborate interior design/decoration/wall and ceiling paintings/sculpture should be counted towards a combined single rating. Currently I am counting much of it, but more study is still needed… On architecture mostly or alone it is still compelling and rather unique on the exterior, but not as high…
Süleymaniye MosqueNot Rated to 7.6/10
Salisbury CathedralNot Rated to 7.5/10
Westminster Abbey (London)Not Rated to 7.5/10
Ulm Minster - Heinrich Parler (Main Design and Principal Architect, mainly 1387 - 1391; continued construction and modification thereafter over centuries; first major construction phase: 1377 - 1543; further construction, modifications thereafter until 1890) / Ulm, Germany [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]7.6/10 to 7.5/10
Imam Mosque - Ali Akbar Isfahani (1611 - 1629) [aka, Shah Mosque] / Naqsh-e Jahan Square, Esfahan, Isfahan Province, Iran [Architecture]8.1/10 to 7.5/10
Basilica of Saint-Denis - Abbot Suger (Principal Architect, Main Construction including the Gothic innovations: 1135 - 1144; key Nave and Transept additions thereafter, mainly 1230 - 1280 with modifications thereafter) / Saint-Denis, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]7.6/10 to 7.5/10
Jeronimos MonasteryNot Rated to 7.4/10
Winchester CathedralNot Rated to 7.4/10
Laon CathedralNot Rated to 7.3/10
Church of Notre Dame du Haut, RonchampNot Rated to 7.3/10
King’s College ChapelNot Rated to 7.3/10
Church of Gesù NuovoNot Rated to 7.5/10; 7.5/10 to 7.3/10
Amiens Cathedral - Robert of Luzarches (1220 - 1228; Building Plan and Principal Architect); Thomas and Regnault de Cormont (1228 - 1258); Renaud de Cormont (1258 - 1288; Mostly constructed 1220 - circa 1270; modifications thereafter) / Amiens, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]7.5/10 to 7.2/10[/b] _________________ Best Classical Best Films Best Paintings
Last edited by AfterHours on 04/09/2026 15:24; edited 13 times in total
Working on this now (still movies too…). Recommendations, discussion welcome
I also have made the overall “Greatest” list more user friendly by adding a space between each listed entry so (with their oftentimes extended titles/artists) they can now be easily differentiated from along the whole list. List is here: https://www.besteveralbums.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15560
Guernica - Pablo Picasso (1937) / Museo Reina Sofía, Madrid, Spain [Painting]8.6/10 to 8.5/10
The Last Supper - Leonardo da Vinci (circa 1495 - 1498) / Santa Maria delle Grazie, Milan, Italy [Painting]8.6/10 to 8.5/10
Sainte-Chapelle - Jean de Chelles or Thomas de Cormont (1242 - 1248) / Paris, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]8.4/10 to 8.3/10
The Conversion of Saul and The Crucifixion of St. Peter - Michelangelo Buonarroti (circa 1542 - 1545; circa 1546 - 1550) / Pauline Chapel, Vatican City, Rome, Italy [Painting]8.4/10 to 8.3/10
Monreale Cathedral - Begun by William II of Sicily in 1174; various modifications thereafter (1267) / Monreale, Sicily, Italy [Architecture, including Mosaics and Structural Sculpture]8.4/10 to 8.2/10
Notre-Dame de Paris - Main construction principally directed under Bishop Maurice de Sully (1163 - 1260, main construction; various additions, updates, restorations thereafter; reconstruction of fleche and roof from fire damages: 2019 - 2024) / Parvis Notre-Dame – Place Jean-Paul-II, Paris, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]8.1/10 to 7.9/10
Batalha Monastery - Afonso Domingues (1388 - 1402); Huguet (1402 - 1438 in which several Flamboyant Gothic elements were added; changed architects posthumously, continued construction, revisions, additions through completion circa 1517) / Batalha, Portugal [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]8.0/10 to 7.7/10
Strasbourg CathedralNot Rated to 7.7/10
Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception (Washington DC)Not Rated to 7.6/10
Houses of Parliament (London)Not Rated to 7.5/10; 7.5/10 to 7.6/10
St Paul’s Cathedral (London)Not Rated to 7.6/10
Süleymaniye MosqueNot Rated to 7.6/10
Salisbury CathedralNot Rated to 7.5/10
Westminster Abbey (London)Not Rated to 7.5/10
Ulm Minster - Heinrich Parler (Main Design and Principal Architect, mainly 1387 - 1391; continued construction and modification thereafter over centuries; first major construction phase: 1377 - 1543; further construction, modifications thereafter until 1890) / Ulm, Germany [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]7.6/10 to 7.5/10
Imam Mosque - Ali Akbar Isfahani (1611 - 1629) [aka, Shah Mosque] / Naqsh-e Jahan Square, Esfahan, Isfahan Province, Iran [Architecture]8.1/10 to 7.5/10
Basilica of Saint-Denis - Abbot Suger (Principal Architect, Main Construction including the Gothic innovations: 1135 - 1144; key Nave and Transept additions thereafter, mainly 1230 - 1280 with modifications thereafter) / Saint-Denis, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]7.6/10 to 7.5/10
Winchester CathedralNot Rated to 7.4/10
Amiens Cathedral - Robert of Luzarches (1220 - 1228; Building Plan and Principal Architect); Thomas and Regnault de Cormont (1228 - 1258); Renaud de Cormont (1258 - 1288; Mostly constructed 1220 - circa 1270; modifications thereafter) / Amiens, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]7.5/10 to 7.2/10[/b]
FYI for those interested: I will be updating the “images and links” section, updating the entries with fuller listings (architect, dates, etc), and adding new pages (on the “Greatest” thread) for any and all new entries as soon as I have more time… for now I’ve just been in a rush and put some key links for each on their listed entry, in bold blue (on the main list, first page, “Greatest” thread)… _________________ Best Classical Best Films Best Paintings
Bold = Newly added
Bold + Italics = Was already listed but recently upgraded/downgraded
Top 10+ Music, Movies, and Visual Art of the Week(s): 3-30-26 - 4-12-26
Strasbourg Cathedral
Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception (Washington DC)
Houses of Parliament, London
The Beethoven Frieze - Gustav Klimt (1902) / Secession Building, Vienna, Austria [Painting]
Down Colorful Hill - Red House Painters (1992)
The Gates of Hell - Auguste Rodin (1889 "Expressionist" Version; Unfinished, revised between two main versions, 1880-1917; Bronze cast 1926-1928) [Sculpture]
Salisbury Cathedral
St. Peter's Basilica - Principal Architects: Donato Bramante (Original design and began construction of central Greek Cross plan: 1503 - 1514); Michelangelo Buonarroti (Revised plan and construction with updated Greek Cross design heavily informing the final result less the later addition of Maderno's Nave and Facade; revision and main design of the central Dome: 1546 - 1564); Carlo Maderno (Revised to Latin Cross plan with addition of central Nave; addition of Facade: 1603 - 1629); Gian Lorenzo Bernini (Revision of St. Peter's Square, addition of Colonnade: 1656 - 1667) (Building completed and opened by 1626; various revisions and additions thereafter) / Vatican City, Rome, Italy [Architecture, including Structural Sculpture]
Sacré-Cœur Basilica
The Starry Night - Vincent van Gogh (1889) [Painting]
Chartres Cathedral - Master of Chartres (Anonymous French Architect) (early phase of construction from 1120s - circa 1165, with only the crypt, towers and West Facade surviving a fire of 1194; thereafter the main Gothic structure as currently seen was largely established structurally from 1194 - 1221; further completion and details from circa 1221 - circa 1250 with consecration in 1260; various modifications and additions thereafter) / Chartres, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]
David - Michelangelo Buonarroti (1501 - 1504) / Galleria dell’Accademia di Firenze, Florence, Italy [Sculpture]
Sainte-Cécile Cathedral
Süleymaniye Mosque
Westminster Abbey
Santiago de Compostela Cathedral (original construction, primarily Romanesque: 1075 - 1211, Pricipal Architect: Bernard the Elder (late 1000s - mid 1100s?); Master Esteban (completed Romanesque Facade: 1103); Pórtico da Gloria, an early work of Romanesque sculpture, Master Mateo (completed 1188); Gothic construction, modifications (especially in the Cloister and some Interior features), more prominently major Baroque construction and modifications, these mainly from 1400s - circa 1770; most notably Fernando de Casas Novoa, constructing the North Tower (aka, da Carraca) and Baroque Facade (circa 1738 - 1760); various other, additions, modifications during that period and thereafter) [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]
Notre-Dame de Paris - Main construction principally directed under Bishop Maurice de Sully (1163 - 1260, main construction; various additions, updates, restorations thereafter; reconstruction of fleche and roof from fire damages: 2019 - 2024) / Parvis Notre-Dame – Place Jean-Paul-II, Paris, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]
Death and the Maiden - Egon Schiele (1915) [Painting]
Church of Gesù Nuovo
The Sleeping Venus - Paul Delvaux (1944) [Painting]
The Deposition - Michelangelo Buonarroti (circa 1547 - 1555; unfinished, abandoned) [aka, "Bandini Pietà" or "The Lamentation over the Dead Christ"] / Museo dell'Opera del Duomo, Florence, Italy [Sculpture]
Seville Cathedral - Alonso Martinez (Lead Architect of Main Structure, peak building period of: 1401 - 1506; after main structure completion, there were several variations and additions across centuries, each main period as follows: Main Gothic structure: 1401 - 1528; Renaissance additions/revisions: 1528 - 1593; Baroque additions/revisions: 1618 - 1758; Academic additions/revisions: 1758 - 1823; Gothic Revival additions/revisions: 1825 - 1928) / Seville, Andalusia, Spain [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]
Apollo and Daphne - Gian Lorenzo Bernini (1625) [Sculpture]
Saint-Nicolas Church - Walter Maria Förderer (1971) / Heremence, Switzerland [Architecture]
Winchester Cathedral
Laon Cathedral
King’s College Chapel
The Ecstasy of Saint Teresa - Gian Lorenzo Bernini (1647 - 1652) / Santa Maria della Vittoria, Rome, Italy [Sculpture, Architecture and Painting]
Not Rated to /10 Not Rated to /10 Not Rated to /10 Not Rated to /10 Not Rated to /10 Not Rated to /10 Not Rated to /10
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TOP 50 WORKS OF ART OF THE YEAR (2026)
A Love Supreme - John Coltrane (1964)
Spiderland - Slint (1991)
Suicide - Suicide (1977)
Geek the Girl - Lisa Germano (1994)
Down Colorful Hill - Red House Painters (1992) Yerself is Steam - Mercury Rev (1991)
St. Peter's Basilica - Principal Architects: Donato Bramante (Original design and began construction of central Greek Cross plan: 1503 - 1514); Michelangelo Buonarroti (Revised plan and construction with updated Greek Cross design heavily informing the final result less the later addition of Maderno's Nave and Facade; revision and main design of the central Dome: 1546 - 1564); Carlo Maderno (Revised to Latin Cross plan with addition of central Nave; addition of Facade: 1603 - 1629); Gian Lorenzo Bernini (Revision of St. Peter's Square, addition of Colonnade: 1656 - 1667) (Building completed and opened by 1626; various revisions and additions thereafter) / Vatican City, Rome, Italy [Architecture, including Structural Sculpture]
Improvisie - Paul Bley (1971)
The Doors - The Doors (1966)
The Black Saint and the Sinner Lady - Charles Mingus (1963)
Piano Sonata No. 32 in C Minor - Ludwig van Beethoven (1822)
Ys - Joanna Newsom (2006)
Y - Pop Group (1979)
Piano Sonata No. 30 in E Major - Ludwig van Beethoven (1820)
Laughing Stock - Talk Talk (1991)
Chartres Cathedral - Master of Chartres (Anonymous French Architect) (early phase of construction from 1120s - circa 1165, with only the crypt, towers and West Facade surviving a fire of 1194; thereafter the main Gothic structure as currently seen was largely established structurally from 1194 - 1221; further completion and details from circa 1221 - circa 1250 with consecration in 1260; various modifications and additions thereafter) / Chartres, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]
The Velvet Underground and Nico - The Velvet Underground (1966)
Bullet in the Head - John Woo (1990)
The Sagrestia Nuova - Michelangelo Buonarroti (1520 - 1533; final composition completed later: 1559) / Medici Chapel, Basilica of San Lorenzo, Florence, Italy [Sculpture and Architecture]
Mission: Impossible III - J. J. Abrams (2006)
Good - Morphine (1992)
Highway 61 Revisited - Bob Dylan (1965)
Master of Puppets - Metallica (1986)
David - Michelangelo Buonarroti (1501 - 1504) / Galleria dell’Accademia di Firenze, Florence, Italy [Sculpture]
Piano Sonata No. 23 in F Minor "Appassionata" - Ludwig van Beethoven (1805)
St Paul’s Cathedral Laurentian Library - Michelangelo Buonarroti (1524 - 1534; completed posthumously: 1571; Tribune of Elci rotunda added by Pasquale Poccianti in 1841) / Basilica di San Lorenzo di Firenze, Florence, Italy [Architecture] Reims Cathedral - Jean d'Orbais (Principal Architect: 1210 - 1228; additional architects, construction, modifications thereafter with the main phase of construction from 1211 - 1275; further modifications through 1345, High Gothic, Rayonnant Style) / Reims, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture] Notre-Dame de Paris - Main construction principally directed under Bishop Maurice de Sully (1163 - 1260, main construction; various additions, updates, restorations thereafter; reconstruction of fleche and roof from fire damages: 2019 - 2024) / Parvis Notre-Dame – Place Jean-Paul-II, Paris, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture] Milan Cathedral - Begun by Simone da Orsenigo; Several architects thereafter (Begun 1386; several stages of development through 1965) / Milan, Italy [Architecture and Sculpture] Batalha Monastery - Afonso Domingues (1388 - 1402); Huguet (1402 - 1438 in which several Flamboyant Gothic elements were added; changed architects posthumously, continued construction, revisions, additions through completion circa 1517) / Batalha, Portugal [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture] Houses of Parliament, London Santiago de Compostela Cathedral (original construction, primarily Romanesque: 1075 - 1211, Pricipal Architect: Bernard the Elder (late 1000s - mid 1100s?); Master Esteban (completed Romanesque Facade: 1103); Pórtico da Gloria, an early work of Romanesque sculpture, Master Mateo (completed 1188); Gothic construction, modifications (especially in the Cloister and some Interior features), more prominently major Baroque construction and modifications, these mainly from 1400s - circa 1770; most notably Fernando de Casas Novoa, constructing the North Tower (aka, da Carraca) and Baroque Facade (circa 1738 - 1760); various other, additions, modifications during that period and thereafter) [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture] Westminster Abbey
Piano Sonata No. 30 in E Major - Ludwig van Beethoven (1820)
Mission: Impossible — Fallout - Christopher McQuarrie (2018)
Star Wars: Episode III - Revenge of the Sith - George Lucas (2005)
The Conversion of Saul and The Crucifixion of St. Peter - Michelangelo Buonarroti (circa 1542 - 1545; circa 1546 - 1550) / Pauline Chapel, Vatican City, Rome, Italy [Painting]
Repeater - Fugazi (1990)
Safe as Milk - Captain Beefheart (1967) Il Paradiso - Jacopo Tintoretto (assisted by son Domenico Tintoretto) (1588 - 1594) / Doge's Palace, Sala del Maggior Consiglio, Venice, Italy [Painting] Ulm Minster - Heinrich Parler (Main Design and Principal Architect, mainly 1387 - 1391; continued construction and modification thereafter over centuries; first major construction phase: 1377 - 1543; further construction, modifications thereafter until 1890) / Ulm, Germany [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture] Basilica of Saint-Denis - Abbot Suger (Principal Architect, Main Construction including the Gothic innovations: 1135 - 1144; key Nave and Transept additions thereafter, mainly 1230 - 1280 with modifications thereafter) / Saint-Denis, France [Architecture, including Stained Glass and Structural Sculpture]
On the Way Down From Moon Palace - Lisa Germano (1991)
Gremlins 2: The New Batch - Joe Dante (1990)
Pieta - Michelangelo Buonarroti (1498 - 1499) / St. Peter's Basilica, Vatican City, Rome, Italy [Sculpture]
The Marble Index - Nico (1968)
Hex - Bark Psychosis (1994)
Sackcloth 'n' Ashes - 16 Horsepower (1996)
Desertshore - Nico (1970) _________________ Best Classical Best Films Best Paintings
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