Post subject: Classical Music: Discussion & Competition
Welcome to what might become the ultimate be completely forgotten in a short time Classical thread. This thread is not only to share your favorite/best Classical music records to compete in the Genre Olympics, but also to learn and share all you want/can about Classical Music and all it's sub-genres.
Competition: (For this game I will accept and tally both the work and the recording separately)
Submit nominations of your top 10 albums - where #10 = 1 point and #1 = 10 points. The ten albums with the most points from these nominations will be in the running for the olympic medal for the genre and then people could listen to all ten and rank the ten with the same points structure to determine the winners. Timeline to be determined.
Discussion:
1. Social/historical/cultural significance
2. Some kind of question you want answered/discussed
3. Thoughts on the production/recordings
4. Analytical critique
5. Interesting stuff about the band/artist
6. Anything else you want to share/ask
I'm not really an album guy when it comes to classical music and I tend to lean towards "the older the better". In both cases I think it has partly to do towards recording techniques of modern day. Giving a classical musician complete control over the outcome of a performance, through the ability to pretty much edit every single note to his liking in hindsight, often leads to a sterilization of the music. There are of course exceptions, but on the whole that is my impression.
Whereas in older days, let's say pre WW2 they did one take, or maybe a few, picked the best one and that was it. Basically a recorded live performance, with all it's little imperfections. What older recordings lack in sound quality they more than make up in creative expression. The notion of perfection which has become an obsession above all in much of today's classical music world is an unfortunate one in my view.
So on that note I'll link some older performances of some of the things you've listed here that sprang to mind when i saw it.
There are recordings of not one but two pianists who actually studied the Greig piano concerto with the composer himself. They are Percy Grainger (more famous as a composer but an outstanding pianist in his prime) and Arthur de Greef (who also studied with Liszt and Saint-Saens).
I saw that you menitoned Winterreise as a contender and I would actually probably put it as no 1 if I would ever attempt a list of favourite compositions. Which is why I was very excited to find the first recording ever made of the entire cycle. Well, I have to say that the singer here is by any standards sub par, such a disappointment. However, it's saving grace is the pianist, the mysterious Mme Orthmann, who blows any other pianist out of the water on these particular pieces that I've heard at least. What phrasings, what rythmic vitality!
Now I'd like to add a few recordings I enjoy, again just from the top of my head
I am a piano geek, so when it comes to solo piano pieces there's TONS of stuff I could post here. but I don't wish to clutter up your thread any more than I already have.
I have no shortage of works... My classical collection numbers over 500, most of which I dearly love and were i to put some thought into it, there's no doubt I could come up with a top 10 according to your criteria.
The problem comes in specific recirdings. Even with pieces I really like, my knowledge of specific performances or recordings is likely to be pretty limited.
I have no shortage of works... My classical collection numbers over 500, most of which I dearly love and were i to put some thought into it, there's no doubt I could come up with a top 10 according to your criteria.
The problem comes in specific recirdings. Even with pieces I really like, my knowledge of specific performances or recordings is likely to be pretty limited.
Look forward to it!
And yeah it can just be the work or the recording or both.
Okay, so here goes. This is gonna' get real long so I'm going to break up each entry into an individual post for ease of readership.
1. Brahms: Symphony #3 in F Major
Discussion:
1, 2 & 4: This may be a shortsighted choice as #1 as this was one of the first great masterworks I heard and fell in love with when I began exploring classical music in my late 20s. The luster has never worn off for me though, and it remains not only a favorite, but also my real number one. I know it's musical/historical significance lags that of his massive 1st and capstone 4th, both of which I also hold in very high esteem. But this one while somewhat less grand in scope seems to say more in less, which is kind of the opposite of my usual preference which is usually for the longer, grander, more complex pieces. But this one is so concise, and still no lightweight at over 36 minutes. What's more, it also benefits from the magnificent 3rd movement, poco allegretto, which now well over two decades after my first exposure, may still be the single most sublime bit of music I've ever laid ears on.
As for a question, I've oft wondered if this one is less revered by the professionals than the 1st and 4th simply because of it's more concise scope.
3. This is one piece, loving it so much as I do, which I have sought out a variety of recordings and poured over them with great focus. The choice pictured is my fave, as it brings the power when the power is appropriate while still being delicate at other points for maximum overall effect. Bruno Walter's recording with the Columbia symphony is a very close second, and while it's never listed among the greats, I also love Gunther Wand's recording with the North German Radio Symphony Orchestra on RCA Victor.
5. Nothing really interesting about Brahms that hasn't already been said a thousand times. Personally, I love the fact that he is considered something of a throwback for his time. Not that I'm against progress, but there's something to be said about perfecting existing forms at a level not previously achieved. Brahms was a master of this. He made much sublime beauty and didn't have to break any glass to do so.
6. I also love Brahms' chamber music. I recall being seated within 10 ft of a string quartet performing his second string quartet and being moved to the point that I could scarcely contain myself. At one point, I was gripping the sides of my chair with intensity. I left the hall feeling like I had had a full on religious epiphany.
2. Bach: Concerto in D Minor for Two Violins and Orchestra, BWV 1043
1. This is possible the greatest treatise on counterpoint ever written. Yet it's no dry, pedantic bit of mathematical formula or mere expo demo; it is positively gripping. This is baroque music that rocks!
2. I really have no questions about this one.
3. The production of my selected recording is actually a little rough, being a live recording that sounds as if less than state of the art recording equipment was used. But the music and the performance are so stellar that I give little thought to the audiophile aspects of the recording while listening.
4. This is baroque music that rocks! (is that analytical enough?). Seriously, the counterpoint here is magnificent. That is partly because each individual line is a ravishingly wonderful melody, and yet they further intertwine so marvelously. It's easy to see why so many point to this as the pinnacle of counterpoint. This music maxes out on both the emotional and intellectual scales. A level of genius unique to Herr Bach, the Senior.
5. Perlman and Stern are two of the most respected and accomplished elder statesmen of classical violin ever. At the time of the recording, they were easily the two most recognized names on the instrument. I don't know whether bringing them together was an artistic or marketing choice, but I think it succeeds wildly at both.
6. This is another of my first exposure pieces, having heard it on the radio driving from work to night school. I was getting tired of rock and was needing something new, so I went old. Fortunately, I was living in metro Boston at the time and Boston had a fantastic classical station, WCRB. I flipped this on and I was floored. Classical quickly became an obsession and my new lifetime love was born.
It may be cliche, but my third entry rounds out the "three Bs" (although this one, Herr Beethoven, is likely my #1 composer, unless of course, it's actually Haydn--it can still change on any given day).
3. Beethoven - Piano Sonata #17 in D Minor, Op. 31 No. 2, "The Tempest"
1. So while with the 3 Bs as my top three choices may have been standard issue, choosing this as my Beethoven entry certainly is not. Really, I could have gone with any of the odd numbered symphonies 3-9, an odd numbered piano concerto, either of the last two string quartets, any of a half dozen other piano sonatas, or even my other personal favorite, the captivating violin concerto. But this is my choice, this, according to most, a decidedly second tier work. There's not a whole lot of significance to this one, at least by Beethoven standards. Okay, so be it.
2. I have no questions about this one, except maybe like my Brahms selection, this one is kept a notch below his more famous works. I find it has all the elements that make his other works the pinnacle of classical music.
3. There is nothing either remarkable or distracting about the production of this recording. It does capture the nuances of Brendel's playing quite well.
4. This one, in classic Beethoven, smacks you right in the face. After slow opening bar followed by a relatively gentle four bar flourish, repeated up a third, a ravishing descending line jumps right out and brings a bit of frenzy to the action, yet a frenzy that needs to be delivered with both delicacy and panache. It's no easy task even for the best of interpreters. The rest of the piece poses equally impressive challenges and, when delivered properly, keeps the attentive listener completely rapt.
5. While there will always be debate as to who the greatest interpreter of Beethoven piano music is, I would say there is no one as there are different moods and attitudes required to maximize the effect of his orchestral piano music and his solo piano music. This sonata, while a solo work, tends to have a rather orchestral feel to it. My personal choice for the best performer of Beethoven's solo piano work is Alfred Brendel, who also masterfully bridges the gap into the orchestral feel as well. But there are days, I think I should actually give these accolades to Claudio Arrau.
6. The nickname of this sonata is actually rather apocryphal. The story is that someone asked Beethoven what his new sonata was about, to which the often smartassed Beethoven simply responded "Read Shakespeare's 'The Tempest'" and walked away. It seems no other explanation exists and nobody really knows if Beethoven was serious or flippant here and musical/literary scholars have not been able to detect anything indicative of a deliberate programme based on Shakespeare's great play.
i'll have something for you eventually. I'm going to re listen to some stuff and not really think about what the greatest is, but what I like right now.
Although, I probably do have a number 1, so I'll drop it here.
I think the best quality of Classical music is its timelessness. Rock and pop trends can come and go and sound dated after a couple of decades, but a monstrous emotional rollercoaster like this piece of music will stand the test of time. And it probably would be something I'd like to listen to if my time was running out. Whether it's a nuclear holocaust or a terminal disease, I hope some part of my brain will be playing this in the background as I pass on; the hope that the ending of my corporeal existence will be met with a spiritual resurrection.
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