Best Year in Hip-Hop Tournament (format and rules) - Games

Mercury
Turn your back on the pay-you-back last call

Gender: Male
Location: St. Louis

Okay, I had a question I PMed to Skinny, but maybe its more of a broad publication type of thing so we are on the same page.

Here is the part I'm curious about and sorry if this is clarified on this or other threads:

"For the quarter-finals, users will nominate four albums and four singles for a matchup against another year. Two albums and two singles can be recycled from a user's group stage picks, whilst two albums and two singles must be previously unused and therefore new to the tournament. The winners of their quarter-final matchup will then proceed to the semi-final."

So if I do make it to next round, and I have used a single from say the ODB album of 1995 - but not the album - can I use both 2 albums previously used but consider Return to The 36 Chambers as a new album despite having used say Shimmy Shimmy Ya as a single in the group stage?
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-Ryan

ONLY 4% of people can understand this chart! Come try!

My Fave Metal - you won't believe #5!!!

Mercury
Turn your back on the pay-you-back last call

Gender: Male
Location: St. Louis

Just got clarification, and it is pretty obvious now that I read all carefully and so forth, that if you use a single from an album you can never use that album as an album ever again in the tournament. Makes sense!
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-Ryan

ONLY 4% of people can understand this chart! Come try!

My Fave Metal - you won't believe #5!!!

kokkinos

To be honest, not sure what this restriction offers. If its aim is to avoid repetition and promote diversity, then I guess it would make more sense to block using the exact same release (album/single) not the one that is directly related to it. (To use an example from my team, it's ok to use Madvillainy twice, but not Madvillainy once and All Caps once, it kinda defies the purpose). On the other hand, maybe the point was to keep it simple, so that rules don't get too complex, but I think this would provide room for some interesting strategic manoeuvres.
Of course, format and rules is none of my business, neither am I trying to cause any controversy. Personally there's no way I'd consider recycling an album/single I've already nominated even if I were to somehow make it to the final - yeah,lol- so it's not like this rule affects me to the slightest, just pointing out what I view as a minor contradiction for discussion's sake.

Skinny
birdman_handrub.gif

kokkinos wrote:

To be honest, not sure what this restriction offers. If its aim is to avoid repetition and promote diversity, then I guess it would make more sense to block using the exact same release (album/single) not the one that is directly related to it. (To use an example from my team, it's ok to use Madvillainy twice, but not Madvillainy once and All Caps once, it kinda defies the purpose). On the other hand, maybe the point was to keep it simple, so that rules don't get too complex, but I think this would provide room for some interesting strategic manoeuvres.
Of course, format and rules is none of my business, neither am I trying to cause any controversy. Personally there's no way I'd consider recycling an album/single I've already nominated even if I were to somehow make it to the final - yeah,lol- so it's not like this rule affects me to the slightest, just pointing out what I view as a minor contradiction for discussion's sake.

I've thought about this a lot, and I think your take is the correct one. As such, I'm going to implement a rule change. For the quarter- and semi-final stages, I am going to offer users who do progress an amnesty of sorts. Users can decide to swap any single they've used for the album it comes from, or vice versa. (This can be done multiple times, with any single or album put forward, so long as they are both from the same year.) For the final, the two users must then pick which to use - they cannot use both. (For example, if I were to advance, I could choose to re-use 'Still D.R.E.' in either the quarter- or semi-final, or I could choose to use the parent album, 2001, instead. If I then progressed to the final, I could pick one or the other to use again.)

I understand that retrofitting rules in this way does mean that some users' previous picks will have been affected, but I can't foresee anybody gaining a particular advantage here. However, this is not a final decision. If there are genuine concerns about this rule change, or suggestions for how to better navigate the knockout stages of the tournament, I'm all ears.
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Streams

Here comes Ridin' Dirty

should've been a dumdum more often

LedZep

Skinny wrote:

kokkinos wrote:

To be honest, not sure what this restriction offers. If its aim is to avoid repetition and promote diversity, then I guess it would make more sense to block using the exact same release (album/single) not the one that is directly related to it. (To use an example from my team, it's ok to use Madvillainy twice, but not Madvillainy once and All Caps once, it kinda defies the purpose). On the other hand, maybe the point was to keep it simple, so that rules don't get too complex, but I think this would provide room for some interesting strategic manoeuvres.
Of course, format and rules is none of my business, neither am I trying to cause any controversy. Personally there's no way I'd consider recycling an album/single I've already nominated even if I were to somehow make it to the final - yeah,lol- so it's not like this rule affects me to the slightest, just pointing out what I view as a minor contradiction for discussion's sake.

I've thought about this a lot, and I think your take is the correct one. As such, I'm going to implement a rule change. For the quarter- and semi-final stages, I am going to offer users who do progress an amnesty of sorts. Users can decide to swap any single they've used for the album it comes from, or vice versa. (This can be done multiple times, with any single or album put forward, so long as they are both from the same year.) For the final, the two users must then pick which to use - they cannot use both. (For example, if I were to advance, I could choose to re-use 'Still D.R.E.' in either the quarter- or semi-final, or I could choose to use the parent album, 2001, instead. If I then progressed to the final, I could pick one or the other to use again.)

I understand that retrofitting rules in this way does mean that some users' previous picks will have been affected, but I can't foresee anybody gaining a particular advantage here. However, this is not a final decision. If there are genuine concerns about this rule change, or suggestions for how to better navigate the knockout stages of the tournament, I'm all ears.

Uh that probably would have been useful to know ahead. Might've used a completely different system, for example Triumph for a single last round... But the rule in general makes sense and I'm all for it. I'm not competitive enough to value my placement in the tourney over overall enjoyment, so I'm still for implementing it starting now.
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2020s
90s

baystateoftheart
Neil Young as a butternut squash

Age: 29
Location: Massachusetts

Skinny wrote:

I can't foresee anybody gaining a particular advantage here.

Streams wrote:

Here comes Ridin' Dirty

Not a huge fan of changing rules mid-game. This won't alter my strategy going forward, but might have for earlier matches. But overall, I don't really care much about whether this change happens.
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Skinny
birdman_handrub.gif

baystateoftheart wrote:

Not a huge fan of changing rules mid-game. This won't alter my strategy going forward, but might have for earlier matches. But overall, I don't really care much about whether this change happens.

Neither am I generally, but here's my thinking: everybody made their group stage picks based on a shared understanding. During the group stage, most users at some point probably had decisions to make regards picking an album vs. picking a single from it - it's not as though anybody had advance warning of a rule change and was given an advantage in that sense. We were all in the same position with regards to the known limitations on picking our teams. People can say it would've altered their picks if they'd known earlier, but that's the same situation for everybody.

The way I see it, it can only be a positive thing to allow a greater level of variety in the tournament.
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cestuneblague
Edgy to the Choir

Location: MA/FL

I'm okay with the new rule. I know it got irritating in the previous year tournaments (especially the first one) when there was a lot of 'double-dipping' ie recycling a single from one of the year's big albums- not only that is was essentially re-using the same music twice but that it was clearly a way to essentially play on the popularity of that particular album for multiple rounds. But if you can't do any of that Double-Dipping in the new final stages even if there's a swap from the preliminary rounds, that seems fine.

RoundTheBend
I miss the comfort in being sad

Location: Ground Control

New Rule:

You must've actually sold crack cocaine in your teens on the streets to move on to the next round.